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全部话题 - 话题: gundotra
1 (共1页)
s********k
发帖数: 6180
1
【 以下文字转载自 JobHunting 讨论区 】
发信人: silverhawk (silverhawk), 信区: JobHunting
标 题: Google+ Head Vic Gundotra Leaving Company
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Thu Apr 24 14:29:50 2014, 美东)
http://recode.net/2014/04/24/exclusive-google-head-vic-gundotra
s********k
发帖数: 6180
a***y
发帖数: 19743
3
☆─────────────────────────────────────☆
aaaty (阿fan提) 于 (Thu May 20 20:24:47 2010, 美东) 提到:
http://digitaldaily.allthingsd.com/20100520/qotd-but-were-just-
“If we did not act, we faced a draconian future. Where one man, one company
, one carrier was the future.”
试翻译为中文:
如果我们不作为,未来将是非常严酷的。未来,将仅仅是一个人(Jobs),一个公司(
Apple),一个运营商(AT&T)。
– Google Vice-President of Engineering Vic Gundotra explains why the
company made Android.
简单地说,Google做搜索是为了全世界更好的组织信息。Google撤出中国是为中国人争
取民主。Google做Android是为了把大家从苹果那... 阅读全帖
o**********e
发帖数: 18403
4
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - GOOGLE 什末情况, 走了个老印?
我猜他要去哪里当CEO害人去了。
看人家是怎么把履历美化的:
1. Demo to Ballmer => soon "was moved" on a divine wind from
washington DC in the corporate headquarters. 多少ppt牛皮可以吹这个?
2. "the code" that underlies network software that underlies .net
"sparked" and "drove" the next PC OS. 多少马工可以做到这个?
3. Gundotra is a "born" proselytizer for technology. 没办法,人家天生神棍!
广大马工们学都学不会啊!
4. He doesn’t know if he’ll stay at Microsoft forever, but he
says, “If you want to change the world, it’s much easier to do it at
Microsoft.”
跟他离开... 阅读全帖
a***y
发帖数: 19743
5
奸细啊奸细Eric Schidmt
“If you believe in openness, if you believe in choice, if you believe in
innovation from everyone, then welcome to Android,” was Gundotra’s
rallying cry. He explained that the mobile platform, from the time it was a
top-secret product by Andy Rubin, had always been destined for this fight.
“If Google does not act we face a draconian future,” Rubin apparently told
Gundotra on the latter’s first day on the job.

company
l******o
发帖数: 2649
6
来自主题: Apple版 - Welcome to Android
http://daringfireball.net/2010/09/the_welcome_to_android
Google vice-president for engineering Vic Gundotra, on-stage at the I/O
developer conference in May, regarding why Google created Android:
If Google didn’t act, it faced a draconian future where one man, one phone,
one carrier were our choice. That’s a future we don’t want.
Vic Gundotra, at I/O:
If you believe in openness, if you believe in choice, if you believe in
innovation from everyone, then welcome to Android.
SkyHook起诉Google显示Androi
g*****g
发帖数: 6798
7
细数谷歌Facebook之战:不同价值主张
环球网 2011-11-05 23:54:32
美国《财富》杂志将于11月刊发布长篇文章,细数谷歌与Facebook之战的来龙去脉,指
出谷歌要想成为社会化网络中的“超级大国”,就必须提出不同于Facebook的价值主张。
保罗-亚当斯(Paul Adams)是硅谷最抢手的人才之一。这位才智超群的产品设计师戴
着方框眼镜,说话带着浓浓的爱尔兰口音,推崇充满激情的技术人员。作为谷歌社交方
向用户体验研究的带头人之一,他帮助公司构想出的新社交网络Google+的一大亮点:
可轻松进行好友分组的灵活“圈子”。但是,他的构想还没变成现实,他就在去年12月
被Facebook挖走了,开始帮后者进行社交广告设计。亚当斯在自己的博客中解释道:“
谷歌看重的是技术,而不是社会科学。”
在有史以来的科技竞争中,像谷歌与Facebook之争这样激烈的战斗十分少见。他们不惜
一切代价拉拢精英人才、吸引大众眼球、开展广告攻势。谷歌和Facebook不像甲骨文和
惠普那样公开诋毁,也不像微软和网景(Netscape)那样战线分明,但是他们投入了巨
大的赌注。他们... 阅读全帖
c***s
发帖数: 70028
8
乔布斯逝世,外界估计他的遗产高达 83亿美元(约 647亿港元),这笔遗产如何分配,备受关注。然而,乔布斯全心发展苹果,不爱高调捐款。他既不捐出公司利润,更曾经拒绝加入富豪捐出身家的行动。
拥有 0.6%苹果股权、 7.4%迪士尼股权的乔布斯,至今仍未有公开捐款行善的纪录。因现时没有一座医院大楼、一座大学校舍以他的名字命名,故令人认为他不是慈善家。在他 1997年重回苹果后,他以提高公司利润为由,关闭公司内的慈善部门, 1986年立 NeXT时曾创立基金,在一年多后亦告关闭。
虽然不能排除乔布斯一直都以匿名人士的身份行善,甚至低调地计划死后捐出身家,但两名亲近乔布斯的好友则透露,乔很少谈及行善,早前更拒绝加入由微软创办人盖茨( Bill Gates图右)及股神毕菲特( Warren Buffett)发起的「捐献誓言」( The Giving Pledge)计划。
他的好友又透露,乔布斯以发展苹果、如何组织强而有力的苹果团队作为生活焦点,特别是他发现患病以后,其他一切事件都是让他分心之事,包括捐钱。
新闻链接
苹果公司继续称霸的八大资本
自乔布斯近日宣布辞去苹果公司CEO的职位起,苹果公... 阅读全帖
r**********g
发帖数: 22734
v****e
发帖数: 10715
10
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,... 阅读全帖
y***l
发帖数: 6963
11
来自主题: Military版 - google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,... 阅读全帖
y***l
发帖数: 6963
12
来自主题: Military版 - google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,... 阅读全帖
j***o
发帖数: 2842
13
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,... 阅读全帖
g********s
发帖数: 895
14
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,... 阅读全帖
o**********e
发帖数: 18403
15
大家不要开骂。 请互相尊重互相学习。
使我想起狗狗有个EVP,以前是软软的general manager.
他的履历如下:
In 1991, XXX, a 21-year-old programmer at Microsoft’s Washington, DC,
office, showed some of his demos to Steve Ballmer, then Microsoft’s head of
sales (and now CEO). ***Soon after, XXX was moved to Microsoft headquarters
in Redmond, WA***. There, XXX and colleagues ran the skunk works project
that resulted in a new architecture for supporting company software
applications across many kinds of computers; now knows as .Net, it won out
... 阅读全帖
c*******8
发帖数: 707
16
来自主题: JobHunting版 - Google+ Head Vic Gundotra Leaving Company
Ppt 做不下去了?眼见facebook蒸蒸日上,看了狗狗的老板生气了
z*****8
发帖数: 2546
17
来自主题: PennySaver版 - 用Google Voice的请注意
Google Voice Hangout integration still isn't done. After the head of Google+
, Vic Gundotra left the company, it is hard to predicate.
S******s
发帖数: 914
18
没用过Win Mobile,对其功能不好评价,但是仅从界面看,Win Phone 7就很cheap,一
块一块的大方格,土得掉渣。NOK的硬件设计特色也很cheap,俩cheap加一起就应了
Gundotra那句话了:Two turkeys do not make an eagle. 这两家的组合前景如何,很
难说。
两强组合的结果要看他们发挥了各自的长处还是短处,目前看这两家算狼狈为奸,目的
是躲避各自的短处。MS需要推销它的软件,NOK需要别人拯救自己于起火的平台,这种
目的与发挥各自的长处有十万光年的差距。另外,这两家的市场观念都有问题,各自失
败的领域都输在观念,企业文化观念不变,Microkia可能是另一个smart phone方面的
三星或LG.

。小弟没了,得花钱了。
l***o
发帖数: 5337
19
佩奇“政绩工程”失败?谷歌正在抛弃Google+
在硬核用户眼中,同为实名社交网络的Google+比Facebook优秀多了:更时尚的设计,
以圈子为核心的范围可控的内容分享机制,以及那些亮眼的附加功能:Photos漂亮的高
分辨率大图、优秀的图片编辑、好用的自动备份、充满灵性的自动特效和Stories;对
了,还有能够轻易驾驭文字、图片以及多人视频的IM hangouts。
但与此同时,就连最忠实的用户也得承认:Google+就是Google迟来多年的Facebook竞
品。除了圈子等一些亮点功能外,它本质上并无创新:笨重的实名社交,仅此而已。那
么,在Facebook已经牢牢确立领先地位的前提下,Google靠什么来说服用户使用Google
+?答案是,强硬粗暴的推广手段——把Google+捆绑式的硬塞到依赖Google服务的用户
那里去,这也促使了Google+被人们称为”the social network we love to hate“。
只要是Google产品的用户,这两年应该都会对Google+在Google系产品中展现出来的“
聚合者”霸道姿态印象深刻。无论是像Gma... 阅读全帖
g********s
发帖数: 895
20
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,... 阅读全帖
p**********u
发帖数: 15479
21
【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
发信人: yokel (uuuu), 信区: Military
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 21:07:27 2013, 美东)
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior ... 阅读全帖
r***e
发帖数: 10135
22
http://www.sina.com.cn 2010年05月23日 10:22 新浪科技
导读:美国科技博客今天刊文称,当前所有重要的科技新闻都与谷歌和苹果有关,
无论是在视频、数字音乐、操作系统,还是在手机领域。而微软正逐渐被边缘化。
在过去20年中,微软一直是科技行业关注的重点。而上一次有关微软的热点事件出
现还是在2007年至2008年,微软和谷歌就收购雅虎和DoubleClick发生的争议。
目前,微软似乎已逐渐被边缘化,很多人都不再关注微软。在上月发布新版iPhone
OS操作系统时,苹果CEO史蒂夫·乔布斯(Steve Jobs)决定将目标瞄准谷歌,而非微软。
当被问到苹果的内容审核政策时,乔布斯指出Android应用商店中存在色情内容。
他随后谈到谷歌收购AdMob的交易。乔布斯表示:“我们曾试图收购AdMob。而谷歌出现
,从我们手中抢走了AdMob。因为他们不希望我们收购AdMob。”
谷歌随后对苹果做出反击。谷歌副总裁维克·冈多特拉(Vic Gundotra)本周四谈到
苹果iPhone,并称市场未来有可能只有一款手机和一款手机操作系统,而这样的未来是
“我们
m*******i
发帖数: 8711
23
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - 大赞狗狗的re-org
Vic Gundotra, Sundar Pichai, Salar Kamangar
f******2
发帖数: 2455
24
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - 传Mark紧急召开Google+对策因应会
这次很多业界人士都发表评论Facebook凶多吉少.
内部人士还表明google这次是采用组合拳的方式, 现在看起来roll out的只是冰山一角
"The parts announced Tuesday represent only a portion of Google’s
plans. In an approach the company refers to as “rolling thunder,”
Google has been quietly been pushing out pieces of its ambitious
social strategy — there are well over 100 launches on its calendar.
When some launches were greeted by yawns, the Emerald Sea team
leaders weren’t ruffled at all — lack of drama is part of the
plan. Google has consciously refrain... 阅读全帖
f******d
发帖数: 6361
25
【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
发信人: veggie (歪叔), 信区: Military
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管 (转载)
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:35:11 2013, 美东)
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Sen... 阅读全帖
Z*******o
发帖数: 10
26
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - 谷歌的阿三高管们
已经全面接管狗狗的各条核心战线,依我看狗狗的衰落已经是指日可待了。
Nikesh Arora
排名仅在Larry/Sergey/Eric之下,手下管1万多人,实际权力排名第二。狗狗的全球
sales VP,什么狗屁都不会,学历低的吓人,Larry让一年 60B 的收入在他手下过,
真是瞎了眼。随便换个五道口技校出身的老中,至少比他多20%。
master’s degree from Boston College and an MBA from Northeastern University
, In 1989, Nikesh graduated from the Institute of Technology in Varanasi。
Amit Singhal
门外汉一个,这么多年管Google Search,只会让人输两字,出来一些网页链接。
Sridhar Ramaswamy
一直跟着苏珊大妈混口饭吃,终于看准机会,把大妈踢走,独揽狗狗 Ads 部门。
狗狗的Ads终于从占公司 99% revenue 跌落到 90%,离大规模崩溃不远了。相比起来
大妈去了Youtube,还算是给老... 阅读全帖
o**********e
发帖数: 18403
27
大家不要开骂。 请互相尊重互相学习。
使我想起狗狗有个EVP,以前是软软的general manager.
他的履历如下:
In 1991, XXX, a 21-year-old programmer at Microsoft’s Washington, DC,
office, showed some of his demos to Steve Ballmer, then Microsoft’s head of
sales (and now CEO). ***Soon after, XXX was moved to Microsoft headquarters
in Redmond, WA***. There, XXX and colleagues ran the skunk works project
that resulted in a new architecture for supporting company software
applications across many kinds of computers; now knows as .Net, it won out
... 阅读全帖
n******h
发帖数: 2482
28
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - Career
The reason why Chinese don't have a say in the society because they have no
power.
The reason why Chinese have no power because they don't have a career.
At best, they have a job. No dreams, no ambitions. After 200 years they are
still a bunch of imported labor.
Yet they look down other races whenever they get a chance.
Now watch this video by Vic Gundotra and find one first-gen Chinese who can
match his stage performance, Taiwanese excluded.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IY3U2GXhz44
Note Vic ... 阅读全帖
c*******8
发帖数: 707
c*******8
发帖数: 707
30
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - GOOGLE 什末情况, 走了个老印?
Copy and Paste here:
In 1991, XXX, a 21-year-old programmer at Microsoft’s Washington, DC,
office, showed some of his demos to Steve Ballmer, then Microsoft’s head of
sales (and now CEO). ***Soon after, XXX was moved to Microsoft headquarters
in Redmond, WA***. There, XXX and colleagues ran the skunk works project
that resulted in a new architecture for supporting company software
applications across many kinds of computers; now knows as .Net, it won out
over several established projects. In 199... 阅读全帖
s*****m
发帖数: 8094
31
来自主题: SanFrancisco版 - GOOGLE 什末情况, 走了个老印?
paste还打马赛克,有病啊。直接上link
http://www2.technologyreview.com/tr35/profile.aspx?TRID=291
Vic Gundotra

of
headquarters
the
g********e
发帖数: 1142
32
oh, 这段历史还真不清楚。
但我说的那个vp是Vic Gundotra。Andy还不算VP。呵呵。 :-)
t****h
发帖数: 113
33
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: tonyzh (fnt!为什么我是RA?), 信区: PDA
标 题: 开放的另一面:从法庭材料解读 Google 如何控制硬件商【转载】
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue May 17 15:43:50 2011, 美东)
这个很有意思。原文跟讨论在http://www.ifanr.com/40746
关于 Skyhook 状告 Google 一事,我们曾在《最近让 Google 烦心的二三事——用户
隐私,人才流失和专利官司》简单提及:
和 Google 同为地理位置服务商之一的 Skyhook Wirless 因 Google 侵犯专利和
反竞争行为将其一纸告上法庭。Skyhook 声称 Google 凭借自身和手机厂商之间的关系
优势,“强制厂商在 Android 设备上运行 Google 的地理位置程序”,甚至还干涉
Skyhook 和摩托罗拉之间的合约,这给他们造成数百万美元的损失。
另外,Skyhook 还状告 Google 侵犯了他们四项专利,但是具体并未被披露。最后
,Skyhook CEO T... 阅读全帖
u**c
发帖数: 17972
34
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Senior Vice President, Android, Chrome & Apps
Vic Gundotra - Senior Vice President, Social (Google plus,
Hangouts, etc.)
Kri... 阅读全帖
D**s
发帖数: 6361
35
印度裔高管Gundotra则是在2014年离职,他曾负责Google+社交网络,但这一项目并未
获得成功,甚至被外界批评为“社交鬼城”。。。

访
b********n
发帖数: 5997
36
【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
发信人: jigao (左季高), 信区: Military
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管 (转载)
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Wed Oct 9 00:01:20 2013, 美东)
发信人: googlefans (Google), 信区: PDA
标 题: google重要部门几乎全被阿三接管
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Oct 8 18:18:22 2013, 美东)
Nikesh Arora - Senior Vice President and Chief Business Officer
Sridhar Ramaswamy - Senior Vice President, Ads & Commerce
Amit Singhal - Senior Vice President and software engineer (
Principal Scientist, Search)
Sundar Pichai -Sen... 阅读全帖
m*x
发帖数: 200
d********f
发帖数: 43471
38
google+简直就是一个joke阿,nm老子点一下别人的goolge+,忘记sign out我的gmail
,这样我就变google+会员了,三哥这ppt作上瘾了吧
a***y
发帖数: 19743
39
CNET notes that Google and Apple are in fact working to bring the
application to the iPhone, although no details of a launch timeframe have
been released.
However, Google is working with Apple on bringing it to the iPhone, and it's
not ruling out licensing the software to makers of portable navigation
devices used in cars throughout the world, said Gundotra, vice president of
engineering at Google for mobile and developers. The process involving Apple
is slightly different from the usual App Sto
a***y
发帖数: 19743
40
http://digitaldaily.allthingsd.com/20100520/qotd-but-were-just-fine-with-the-two-men-one-company-one-search-engine-model/
“If we did not act, we faced a draconian future. Where one man, one company
, one carrier was the future.”
试翻译为中文:
如果我们不作为,未来将是非常严酷的。未来,将仅仅是一个人(Jobs),一个公司(
Apple),一个运营商(AT&T)。
– Google Vice-President of Engineering Vic Gundotra explains why the
company made Android.
简单地说,Google做搜索是为了全世界更好的组织信息。Google撤出中国是为中国人争
取民主。Google做Android是为了把大家从苹果那里解救出来。
WSJ点评的好,Google虚伪,因为显然在Google眼里,
w*****g
发帖数: 16352
41
War?

http://digitaldaily.allthingsd.com/20100520/qotd-but-were-just-fine-with-the-two-men-one-company-one-search-engine-model/
“If we did not act, we faced a draconian future. Where one man, one company
, one carrier was the future.”
试翻译为中文:
如果我们不作为,未来将是非常严酷的。未来,将仅仅是一个人(Jobs),一个公司(
Apple),一个运营商(AT&T)。
– Google Vice-President of Engineering Vic Gundotra explains why the
company made Android.
简单地说,Google做搜索是为了全世界更好的组织信息。Google撤出中国是为中国人争
取民主。Google做Android是为了把大家从苹果那里解救出来。
WSJ点评的好,Google虚伪,因为显然在Goo
j**h
发帖数: 173
42
来自主题: Apple版 - Re: quadroid vs wintel (转载)
【 以下文字转载自 PDA 讨论区 】
发信人: josh (joshua), 信区: PDA
标 题: Re: quadroid vs wintel
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Sun Dec 5 12:44:32 2010, 美东)
The elephant in the room is the network carriers, who are enormously
powerful (oligopoly) and do not want to see a dominant platform that sway
the power from them.
A second factor is that the smartphone market has been so far driven by
consumers, where user experience and consumer applications is more important
than office productivity software on PC, which happened to be c... 阅读全帖
1 (共1页)