k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 1 如果以后找不到工作,不想推迟毕业,但又不希望工作经验中有一个阶段空白,能不能跟导
师说做postdoc,但不用他付钱. 大家都打算怎样handle找不到工作的情况? 难道都推迟
PhD毕业? |
c**c
发帖数: 2593 | 2 干postdoc的活，又不用你老板掏钱，他还不高兴么。
美国这里好像经常有外国政府出钱送过来postdoc的人吧，
所以老板不用出钱的postdoc应该不是太罕见。
导
迟
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: 如果以后找不到工作,不想推迟毕业,但又不希望工作经验中有一个阶段空白,能不能跟导
: 师说做postdoc,但不用他付钱. 大家都打算怎样handle找不到工作的情况? 难道都推迟
: PhD毕业?
|
f*****p
发帖数: 235 | 3 The key is the status.
导
迟
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: 如果以后找不到工作,不想推迟毕业,但又不希望工作经验中有一个阶段空白,能不能跟导
: 师说做postdoc,但不用他付钱. 大家都打算怎样handle找不到工作的情况? 难道都推迟
: PhD毕业?
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 4 如果没有谁出钱,只要一个title行不行?
跟
推
【在 c**c 的大作中提到】
: 干postdoc的活，又不用你老板掏钱，他还不高兴么。
: 美国这里好像经常有外国政府出钱送过来postdoc的人吧，
: 所以老板不用出钱的postdoc应该不是太罕见。
:
: 导
: 迟
|
i******s
发帖数: 8734 | 5 可以，但是你的有个身分。
H1 是没戏了
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: 如果没有谁出钱,只要一个title行不行?
:
: 跟
: 推
|
s***w
发帖数: 521 | 6 opt :)
let me know if you want to do it :)
【在 i******s 的大作中提到】
: 可以，但是你的有个身分。
: H1 是没戏了
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 7 really? Are you a faculty? hehe. I asked my advisor today, he said postdoc
is an employment and he needs to do paperwork, so he has to pay. Is he wrong?
【在 s***w 的大作中提到】
: opt :)
: let me know if you want to do it :)
|
s***w
发帖数: 521 | 8 how about opt, then?
postdoc
wrong?
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: really? Are you a faculty? hehe. I asked my advisor today, he said postdoc
: is an employment and he needs to do paperwork, so he has to pay. Is he wrong?
:
|
i******s
发帖数: 8734 | 9 你可以做 volunteer. J1, h4 的肯定可以。 opt 不知道
postdoc
wrong?
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: really? Are you a faculty? hehe. I asked my advisor today, he said postdoc
: is an employment and he needs to do paperwork, so he has to pay. Is he wrong?
:
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 10 He mentioned volunteered RA. He said one can be volunteered RA, i.e., even if
you are not paid, you can say that you are RA in your resume, but postdoc
cannot. I think postdoc without money cannot apply for J1 or H1, but not sure
if he means that one with opt has to be paid for postdoc.
【在 i******s 的大作中提到】
: 你可以做 volunteer. J1, h4 的肯定可以。 opt 不知道
:
: postdoc
: wrong?
|
|
|
i******s
发帖数: 8734 | 11 申请 H1 肯定不行。
j1 可以自己 pay 自己， 出个银行证明就行。
if
sure
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: He mentioned volunteered RA. He said one can be volunteered RA, i.e., even if
: you are not paid, you can say that you are RA in your resume, but postdoc
: cannot. I think postdoc without money cannot apply for J1 or H1, but not sure
: if he means that one with opt has to be paid for postdoc.
|
i******s
发帖数: 8734 | 12 postdoc 也是ra 呀。
research assistant 呀。
if
sure
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: He mentioned volunteered RA. He said one can be volunteered RA, i.e., even if
: you are not paid, you can say that you are RA in your resume, but postdoc
: cannot. I think postdoc without money cannot apply for J1 or H1, but not sure
: if he means that one with opt has to be paid for postdoc.
|
r****c
发帖数: 2585 | 13 Why you want to be an postdoc still under you advisor
if you can not find a job now then it is highly possible
that you can not find a job later even with the experience with
the same advisor, anyone will not like this kind of postdoc
because they will find you are not indenpendent enough
even
【在 i******s 的大作中提到】
: postdoc 也是ra 呀。
: research assistant 呀。
:
: if
: sure
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 14 why being a postdoc under the same advisor is independent? But this is not a
problem here, if one can be a postdoc without salary, he can definitely find
someone else as postdoc advisor.
【在 r****c 的大作中提到】
: Why you want to be an postdoc still under you advisor
: if you can not find a job now then it is highly possible
: that you can not find a job later even with the experience with
: the same advisor, anyone will not like this kind of postdoc
: because they will find you are not indenpendent enough
:
: even
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 15 Is it? I think Postdoc is research associate...
even
【在 i******s 的大作中提到】
: postdoc 也是ra 呀。
: research assistant 呀。
:
: if
: sure
|
Q*******e
发帖数: 939 | 16 呵呵，白送的都不是好东西！
还是要钱的好
导
迟
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: 如果以后找不到工作,不想推迟毕业,但又不希望工作经验中有一个阶段空白,能不能跟导
: 师说做postdoc,但不用他付钱. 大家都打算怎样handle找不到工作的情况? 难道都推迟
: PhD毕业?
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 17 不白送也不一定有钱啊.我们这有一个,待了8年,还没找到工作,已经两年没有support了,
还要自己付学费.现在I20都成问题,因为I20只给8年. 以前还有一个,最后一年没support,
要借钱过日子,还好毕业找到工作. 现在经济不好,funding少,越来越多人没钱,老师一般
都照顾新学生,推迟毕业也不是办法,谁知道哪一天会没钱,与其做个没钱的PhD,自己付学
费,不如做个没钱的postdoc,如果可以的话. 现在老师最不缺的就是学生. 呵呵.
【在 Q*******e 的大作中提到】
: 呵呵，白送的都不是好东西！
: 还是要钱的好
:
: 导
: 迟
|
a*********e
发帖数: 228 | 18 CS phd?? can not believe it.
,
support,
般
学
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: 不白送也不一定有钱啊.我们这有一个,待了8年,还没找到工作,已经两年没有support了,
: 还要自己付学费.现在I20都成问题,因为I20只给8年. 以前还有一个,最后一年没support,
: 要借钱过日子,还好毕业找到工作. 现在经济不好,funding少,越来越多人没钱,老师一般
: 都照顾新学生,推迟毕业也不是办法,谁知道哪一天会没钱,与其做个没钱的PhD,自己付学
: 费,不如做个没钱的postdoc,如果可以的话. 现在老师最不缺的就是学生. 呵呵.
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 19 yes, cs phd, he almost quited PhD program after being here for 7 years.
Since he had not found a job and he did not want to lose status, he did not quit
finally. Since Aug., he will be a 9th year student. I heard that his's
status has problem because his I20 expiration date is the end of this month
(but this may not matter as he had applied for OPT).
Actually, he is very good at programming and system administration and had
applied only for industry jobs. It is strange that he cannot even ge |
c**c
发帖数: 2593 | 20 Maybe he doesn't have good communication skills?
No matter how good technical skills you have, to
show them effectively you still need pretty good
communication skills...
quit
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: yes, cs phd, he almost quited PhD program after being here for 7 years.
: Since he had not found a job and he did not want to lose status, he did not quit
: finally. Since Aug., he will be a 9th year student. I heard that his's
: status has problem because his I20 expiration date is the end of this month
: (but this may not matter as he had applied for OPT).
: Actually, he is very good at programming and system administration and had
: applied only for industry jobs. It is strange that he cannot even ge
|
|
|
a*********e
发帖数: 228 | 21 靠，这可是头一次听说，CS的phd呆了7年还找不到工作，太衰了。
quit
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: yes, cs phd, he almost quited PhD program after being here for 7 years.
: Since he had not found a job and he did not want to lose status, he did not quit
: finally. Since Aug., he will be a 9th year student. I heard that his's
: status has problem because his I20 expiration date is the end of this month
: (but this may not matter as he had applied for OPT).
: Actually, he is very good at programming and system administration and had
: applied only for industry jobs. It is strange that he cannot even ge
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 22 possible. He does not have problem in English, but seems that he cannot
communicate with other people very well. He was quite conceit before, then he
changed after he was frustrated by all kinds of failures.
【在 c**c 的大作中提到】
: Maybe he doesn't have good communication skills?
: No matter how good technical skills you have, to
: show them effectively you still need pretty good
: communication skills...
:
: quit
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 23 8 years. In the future, there will be more and more such cases. also it depends on major. His
major is not as practical as systems research such as networking, operating system. Not many Academy openings in USA. But he has very good programming skills and system administration. I
think he has to defend before his opt expire, otherwise, he will end up with only a master degree
after 8.5 years. CS PhD job market is worse and worse in the future and more and more CS PhDs
are going to graduate,
【在 a*********e 的大作中提到】
: 靠，这可是头一次听说，CS的phd呆了7年还找不到工作，太衰了。
:
: quit
|
c**c
发帖数: 2593 | 24 是不是眼光也比较高，次一点的工作都不想去？或者找工作也没
有真正尽心尽力。今年工作市场还是比去年要好吧，真正下了决
心要找到工作的话，只要尽了力，只要不太挑剔，好像没有一整
年都找不到工作的道理。。。
he
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: possible. He does not have problem in English, but seems that he cannot
: communicate with other people very well. He was quite conceit before, then he
: changed after he was frustrated by all kinds of failures.
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 25 He did not apply for any faculty jobs. He applied to industry jobs and got a
couple of interviews, such as microsoft, google, ibm, etc., but did get any
offer. He has also applied for some research labs and finance companies, but
just cannot get a job. Seems that he tried quite hard - he did not do any
research in one semester - kept applying for jobs and giving interviews. I
did not know many details about his stuff. He is not a Chinese. It is really
frustrating as almost all master stude
【在 c**c 的大作中提到】
: 是不是眼光也比较高，次一点的工作都不想去？或者找工作也没
: 有真正尽心尽力。今年工作市场还是比去年要好吧，真正下了决
: 心要找到工作的话，只要尽了力，只要不太挑剔，好像没有一整
: 年都找不到工作的道理。。。
:
: he
|
a*********e
发帖数: 228 | 26 这么多interview一个都没搞定？sigh....
a
but
really
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: He did not apply for any faculty jobs. He applied to industry jobs and got a
: couple of interviews, such as microsoft, google, ibm, etc., but did get any
: offer. He has also applied for some research labs and finance companies, but
: just cannot get a job. Seems that he tried quite hard - he did not do any
: research in one semester - kept applying for jobs and giving interviews. I
: did not know many details about his stuff. He is not a Chinese. It is really
: frustrating as almost all master stude
|
c**c
发帖数: 2593 | 27 如果目光只局限于那几个大牌公司，那也还是太挑剔了点，呵呵。
a
but
really
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: He did not apply for any faculty jobs. He applied to industry jobs and got a
: couple of interviews, such as microsoft, google, ibm, etc., but did get any
: offer. He has also applied for some research labs and finance companies, but
: just cannot get a job. Seems that he tried quite hard - he did not do any
: research in one semester - kept applying for jobs and giving interviews. I
: did not know many details about his stuff. He is not a Chinese. It is really
: frustrating as almost all master stude
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 28 I heard that he somehow thought one company he interviewed would make offer to
him, so he applied for opt. But it turned out that he did not get. It is
really bad to apply for opt before getting a job if he has status problem.
【在 a*********e 的大作中提到】
: 这么多interview一个都没搞定？sigh....
:
: a
: but
: really
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 29 there should be some problem with him?
there is one postdoc in our dep, he graduate with top school
and lots of papers, but only be a postdoc for 5 years and seems the
chance to get a faculty is small.
to
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: I heard that he somehow thought one company he interviewed would make offer to
: him, so he applied for opt. But it turned out that he did not get. It is
: really bad to apply for opt before getting a job if he has status problem.
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 30 I think he has applied for not only big companies. I am not familiar with him
- heard about it from his friends. They just mentioned big companies to me.
He should have applied for small companies because he is going to be out of
status before Dec. and he did not want to leave USA. I guess small companies
prefer master students to PhD students because master students are enough for
programming work and they need pay PhD students more. Also small companies may
not sponsor H1.
【在 c**c 的大作中提到】
: 如果目光只局限于那几个大牌公司，那也还是太挑剔了点，呵呵。
:
: a
: but
: really
|
|
|
e*****n
发帖数: 39 | 31 What's the problem with this postdoc?
Does he has communication problem?
【在 w********d 的大作中提到】
: there should be some problem with him?
: there is one postdoc in our dep, he graduate with top school
: and lots of papers, but only be a postdoc for 5 years and seems the
: chance to get a faculty is small.
:
: to
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 32 yep, says someething about communication and
his research may be too theory.
【在 e*****n 的大作中提到】
: What's the problem with this postdoc?
: Does he has communication problem?
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 33 Dont know. Maybe his field is a little bit narrow and is not as practical as
networking or os. The department's ranking is within top 30, but he just
cannot get a job. He is not the only PhD who cannot get a job in one year,
but he is the one who has been here for so long time.
You mean the postdoc in your dept. has been a postdoc for 5 years?
【在 w********d 的大作中提到】
: there should be some problem with him?
: there is one postdoc in our dep, he graduate with top school
: and lots of papers, but only be a postdoc for 5 years and seems the
: chance to get a faculty is small.
:
: to
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 34 For theoretical people, if they cannot get a faculty position, they almost
cannot go anywhere.
【在 w********d 的大作中提到】
: yep, says someething about communication and
: his research may be too theory.
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 35 yep, he graduate from top school and has been postdoc for 5 years
many interviews,
how many phds in your dep can't get job?
as
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: Dont know. Maybe his field is a little bit narrow and is not as practical as
: networking or os. The department's ranking is within top 30, but he just
: cannot get a job. He is not the only PhD who cannot get a job in one year,
: but he is the one who has been here for so long time.
: You mean the postdoc in your dept. has been a postdoc for 5 years?
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 36 that is true,
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: For theoretical people, if they cannot get a faculty position, they almost
: cannot go anywhere.
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 37 Before last year, almost everybody can get a job. Most got faculty job. This
year, nobody got a faculty job, actually, less than 1/3 applicants got
faculty interviews. All people who got jobs are in industry. So far, not
many did not get job, but in the future years, I guess the number will
increase dramatically because the number of PhDs who stay in PhD program
increased dramatically since 2001.
【在 w********d 的大作中提到】
: yep, he graduate from top school and has been postdoc for 5 years
: many interviews,
: how many phds in your dep can't get job?
:
: as
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 38 yep, it is quite true, there are lots of phd enrolled in 2001 and 2002.
it is the time to graduate.
the cs phd will really be very hard to find a faculty position.
btw: how about these who can't find job?
This
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: Before last year, almost everybody can get a job. Most got faculty job. This
: year, nobody got a faculty job, actually, less than 1/3 applicants got
: faculty interviews. All people who got jobs are in industry. So far, not
: many did not get job, but in the future years, I guess the number will
: increase dramatically because the number of PhDs who stay in PhD program
: increased dramatically since 2001.
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 39 They are postponding graduation. This is the reason why I asked the question in
the title: The job market is tougher and tougher, if we cannot find a job in
the future, then what should we do. More and more PhD students are also
losing support, like that 8th year guy, he has to pay tuition and all living
expensis by himself, so postponding graduation is also not a good way...
【在 w********d 的大作中提到】
: yep, it is quite true, there are lots of phd enrolled in 2001 and 2002.
: it is the time to graduate.
: the cs phd will really be very hard to find a faculty position.
: btw: how about these who can't find job?
:
: This
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 40 can't find a postdoc with support?
and I think there might be other ways
such as turn to finance if you good at math and cs
question in
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: They are postponding graduation. This is the reason why I asked the question in
: the title: The job market is tougher and tougher, if we cannot find a job in
: the future, then what should we do. More and more PhD students are also
: losing support, like that 8th year guy, he has to pay tuition and all living
: expensis by himself, so postponding graduation is also not a good way...
|
|
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 41 It also depends on fields. In some fields, it is difficult to find even a
postdoc position. If you are very good at math and modeling, you can turn to
finance. A friend who is working in a finance company told me that almost all
people who work on modeling in her company are from good schools like Mit,
Stanford, Yale....
【在 w********d 的大作中提到】
: can't find a postdoc with support?
: and I think there might be other ways
: such as turn to finance if you good at math and cs
:
: question in
|
w********d
发帖数: 275 | 42 sometime it is really hard for cs phd
now many phd do bioinformatics, but who knows
in the future
to
all
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: It also depends on fields. In some fields, it is difficult to find even a
: postdoc position. If you are very good at math and modeling, you can turn to
: finance. A friend who is working in a finance company told me that almost all
: people who work on modeling in her company are from good schools like Mit,
: Stanford, Yale....
|
Q*******e
发帖数: 939 | 43 自己弯下身子去工作啊
难道还烂死在美国不成
,
support,
般
学
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: 不白送也不一定有钱啊.我们这有一个,待了8年,还没找到工作,已经两年没有support了,
: 还要自己付学费.现在I20都成问题,因为I20只给8年. 以前还有一个,最后一年没support,
: 要借钱过日子,还好毕业找到工作. 现在经济不好,funding少,越来越多人没钱,老师一般
: 都照顾新学生,推迟毕业也不是办法,谁知道哪一天会没钱,与其做个没钱的PhD,自己付学
: 费,不如做个没钱的postdoc,如果可以的话. 现在老师最不缺的就是学生. 呵呵.
|
a*********e
发帖数: 228 | 44 why kind of field in CS could be so bad in job market? Pure computation theory
?
to
all
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: It also depends on fields. In some fields, it is difficult to find even a
: postdoc position. If you are very good at math and modeling, you can turn to
: finance. A friend who is working in a finance company told me that almost all
: people who work on modeling in her company are from good schools like Mit,
: Stanford, Yale....
|
r****c
发帖数: 2585 | 45 Just work hard guys,
if you are really goo, then you definitely can find
a job no matter acad or indu.
theory
【在 a*********e 的大作中提到】
: why kind of field in CS could be so bad in job market? Pure computation theory
: ?
:
: to
: all
|
a*********e
发帖数: 228 | 46 hehe, sometimes, work hard is no use, i don't think
that guy was lazy.
【在 r****c 的大作中提到】
: Just work hard guys,
: if you are really goo, then you definitely can find
: a job no matter acad or indu.
:
: theory
|
t**********g
发帖数: 3388 | 47 这话说得似乎没道理。怎么work hard? work hard什么？
大家都知道，前进分为动力和方向两部分。没有方向的work hard，就如同开足马力的汽
车在乱闯。
【在 r****c 的大作中提到】
: Just work hard guys,
: if you are really goo, then you definitely can find
: a job no matter acad or indu.
:
: theory
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 48 He is not lazy, but he likes programming more than research. Do not know why
he chose PhD at the beginning. Also he was seldom RA, most time, he was TA,
instructor or par-time system adminstrator. I think that's why he applied
only for industry job.
Also, less than 1/3 passed qualify exam in his batch and he was one of them.
The exam was not eazy at all, so I do not think he is dumb.
【在 a*********e 的大作中提到】
: hehe, sometimes, work hard is no use, i don't think
: that guy was lazy.
|
k*****e
发帖数: 152 | 49 方向和导师真的很重要. 只是读了好几年以后,听了那么多找工经历才深刻理解到. sigh.
汽
【在 t**********g 的大作中提到】
: 这话说得似乎没道理。怎么work hard? work hard什么？
: 大家都知道，前进分为动力和方向两部分。没有方向的work hard，就如同开足马力的汽
: 车在乱闯。
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r*****y
发帖数: 507 | 50 well, I feel in most of CS fields, it is hard to
find a postDoc (because open positions are limited).
btw, here I exclude bioinfo as a CS field. In some sense, it more like
recruiting postdoc is similar to bio field's case too.
to
all
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: It also depends on fields. In some fields, it is difficult to find even a
: postdoc position. If you are very good at math and modeling, you can turn to
: finance. A friend who is working in a finance company told me that almost all
: people who work on modeling in her company are from good schools like Mit,
: Stanford, Yale....
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E**e
发帖数: 524 | 51 没有拿钱，但是自己申请到了很高的奖学金，觉得postdoc还是要给钱的，要不然身份上
就过不去，除非老板跟你一起作假。
btw，我同学是美国人，那个学校在他学的专业应该有前5了，很有前途。
【在 f*****p 的大作中提到】
: The key is the status.
:
: 导
: 迟
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r*****y
发帖数: 507 | 52 that's the point.
americans can apply NSF postdoc fellowship.
but it is not for international students.
上
【在 E**e 的大作中提到】
: 没有拿钱，但是自己申请到了很高的奖学金，觉得postdoc还是要给钱的，要不然身份上
: 就过不去，除非老板跟你一起作假。
: btw，我同学是美国人，那个学校在他学的专业应该有前5了，很有前途。
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i******s
发帖数: 8734 | 53 J1 可以自己pay 自己
只要你出个银行证明就行
上
【在 E**e 的大作中提到】
: 没有拿钱，但是自己申请到了很高的奖学金，觉得postdoc还是要给钱的，要不然身份上
: 就过不去，除非老板跟你一起作假。
: btw，我同学是美国人，那个学校在他学的专业应该有前5了，很有前途。
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s***w
发帖数: 521 | 54 by the way, what is your field?
and his field?
why
【在 k*****e 的大作中提到】
: He is not lazy, but he likes programming more than research. Do not know why
: he chose PhD at the beginning. Also he was seldom RA, most time, he was TA,
: instructor or par-time system adminstrator. I think that's why he applied
: only for industry job.
: Also, less than 1/3 passed qualify exam in his batch and he was one of them.
: The exam was not eazy at all, so I do not think he is dumb.
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r****c
发帖数: 2585 | 55 then I would like to say the guy is not smart if not dumb
pass the qualify only shows that he is diligent
failing to get an offer from google, micro etc
means not smart
【在 s***w 的大作中提到】
: by the way, what is your field?
: and his field?
:
: why
:
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