c****1
发帖数: 457 | 1 Did FBI explicitly say online poker is illegal in this black friday? They
only charge the illegal online payment process, right?what's their opinion
after all? Do they think we can play poker online, but not with real money?
Is banking institutions allowed to handle poker players' moneys? Is poker
gambling?i think this is the key. If poker is gambling, then no bank should
touch it. Otherwise, online poker is absolutely legal. | f*****g
发帖数: 15860 | 2 two key issues:
1) is poker a game of luck (gambling) or skill?
lots of debates on this, and in some states, judges ruled poker is a game of
skill. but at the federal level, no such decision yet, or so far, it's
still considered gambling;
2) so per 1 and according to UIEGA, no player from u.s. could deposit money
onto those poker sites. FTP/PS/AB, they all broke this by using middle
processors. so no doubt, they're criminals in this case.
our hope is on 1 and that's what senator reid tried to pass last year. if
one day this indeed happens, we can fully expect another huge poker boom.
?
should
【在 c****1 的大作中提到】
: Did FBI explicitly say online poker is illegal in this black friday? They
: only charge the illegal online payment process, right?what's their opinion
: after all? Do they think we can play poker online, but not with real money?
: Is banking institutions allowed to handle poker players' moneys? Is poker
: gambling?i think this is the key. If poker is gambling, then no bank should
: touch it. Otherwise, online poker is absolutely legal.
| f*****r
发帖数: 754 | 3 1. online gambling是否合法？针对player.
2. 抽取online gambling/gaming的rake是否合法？针对PS/FTP/AB等.
3. Poker是否算作online gambling?
4. 是否应该禁止online poker导致的境内的/国际的货币换手/流通?
以现在PS/FTP/AB所面临的指控来说，第一条，政府没管或者说大家在打擦边球. 第二
条，似乎政府管不着，因为这些是境外注册的公司. 第三条，看来是有争议。第四条，
绝对禁止。
政府的结论是，你怎么玩，我不管或者管不了，但是，由这些活动产生的货币流通，我
得禁止。
of
money
【在 f*****g 的大作中提到】
: two key issues:
: 1) is poker a game of luck (gambling) or skill?
: lots of debates on this, and in some states, judges ruled poker is a game of
: skill. but at the federal level, no such decision yet, or so far, it's
: still considered gambling;
: 2) so per 1 and according to UIEGA, no player from u.s. could deposit money
: onto those poker sites. FTP/PS/AB, they all broke this by using middle
: processors. so no doubt, they're criminals in this case.
: our hope is on 1 and that's what senator reid tried to pass last year. if
: one day this indeed happens, we can fully expect another huge poker boom.
| p****r
发帖数: 9164 | 4 I think there is no explicit law saying online poker is
illegal, so it is still a gray area ,that why these small site still hang
around.
I think it will be a mattter of time that online poker got legaized.
Do not know how it be look like. At the same time, can not bank on it too
soon. I expect at least one year, and could be a lot longer. So if you were
making a living with online poker, have to prepare for someting else. I played
live poker full time for a while before starting online, so sort of
comfortable to go back to live. To be honest, best place for live poker is
not Vegas unless you are super high stakes(over 25-50NL), LA is the best for
most ppl. The 10-20NL game in commerce is like 2-5 NL in vegas sometime there.I know a few Chinese guy there make over a million playing live after a few years. It is not as easy as before though.
of
money
【在 f*****g 的大作中提到】
: two key issues:
: 1) is poker a game of luck (gambling) or skill?
: lots of debates on this, and in some states, judges ruled poker is a game of
: skill. but at the federal level, no such decision yet, or so far, it's
: still considered gambling;
: 2) so per 1 and according to UIEGA, no player from u.s. could deposit money
: onto those poker sites. FTP/PS/AB, they all broke this by using middle
: processors. so no doubt, they're criminals in this case.
: our hope is on 1 and that's what senator reid tried to pass last year. if
: one day this indeed happens, we can fully expect another huge poker boom.
| f*****g
发帖数: 15860 | 5 i guess so, only two types of players in LV, tourists or pros, and tourists
won't be there for long or play high stake all the time.
were
played
for
【在 p****r 的大作中提到】
: I think there is no explicit law saying online poker is
: illegal, so it is still a gray area ,that why these small site still hang
: around.
: I think it will be a mattter of time that online poker got legaized.
: Do not know how it be look like. At the same time, can not bank on it too
: soon. I expect at least one year, and could be a lot longer. So if you were
: making a living with online poker, have to prepare for someting else. I played
: live poker full time for a while before starting online, so sort of
: comfortable to go back to live. To be honest, best place for live poker is
: not Vegas unless you are super high stakes(over 25-50NL), LA is the best for
| y********n
发帖数: 2063 | 6 Did FBI explicitly say online poker is illegal in this black friday? | f*f
发帖数: 121 | 7 1) is online poker illegal for the player -- not at the federal level, could
be a misdemeanor offense in some states because state law. It's a felony
charge in state of Washington? Anyway, no player has ever been charged as
far as I know, even in the state of Washington, and there are many famous
online player live in that state still.
2) Is online poker illegal for the site to offer games to USA player? -- It
's a grey area thing, but if challenged in court, I think there is a pretty
good chance that DOJ will win. But at the same time, that kind of ruling
can be challenged by WTO ruling on fair competition because USA law do allow
state-run lottery and horse racing betting.
AFAIK, the main charges for this Friday's action actually doesn't involve
poker at all, it's all about bank fraud and violation of UIGEA (DOJ is not
saying pokerstars/ftp can't offer games to the players, but they can't do
any money transfer to the players, it's the same effect, but this way they
don't even need to prove if poker is gambling or not). | p****r
发帖数: 9164 | 8 what is your plan after BF?
back to normal job, move outside U.S or more live game? when will you
come to Vegas? maybe we can meet up and talk about it.
could
It
pretty
allow
【在 f*f 的大作中提到】
: 1) is online poker illegal for the player -- not at the federal level, could
: be a misdemeanor offense in some states because state law. It's a felony
: charge in state of Washington? Anyway, no player has ever been charged as
: far as I know, even in the state of Washington, and there are many famous
: online player live in that state still.
: 2) Is online poker illegal for the site to offer games to USA player? -- It
: 's a grey area thing, but if challenged in court, I think there is a pretty
: good chance that DOJ will win. But at the same time, that kind of ruling
: can be challenged by WTO ruling on fair competition because USA law do allow
: state-run lottery and horse racing betting.
| f*f
发帖数: 121 | 9 I already rented a house in Vegas for a few weeks in the summer for wsop,
after that, I will be spending at least a few
months in china. (without bf, I would be doing the same anyway). In the
meantime, I have a lot of other things to keep
myself busy, some poker related, some has nothing to do with poker. Bf
sucks big time, but it probably affects me
much less than most other pros.
【在 p****r 的大作中提到】
: what is your plan after BF?
:
: back to normal job, move outside U.S or more live game? when will you
: come to Vegas? maybe we can meet up and talk about it.
:
: could
: It
: pretty
: allow
| d******d
发帖数: 16 | 10 I think this article gives a rather clear picture of the issues involved:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Scheinberg_et_al.
I don't think taxing online gaming will be an issue at all, if the gov wants
to do it. It's more of an ideological issue than anything else. At the end
of the day, it's an balancing act. Making an extreme case here to show what
I mean: IF the tax is on the level of 10 trillions a year, no questions
asked -- if you want to get elected and/or create jobs, balancing budget etc
etc, you'd do it in a heartbeat. At current level, it's not going to make
much of a difference, financially at least. That's where a good lobbying
group can make a difference. Unfortunately, PPA is not one of them.
This was a simple issue and they should've made something happen right after
2006 and basically did nothing, even after June 2010. So they deserved this
. fryking was right...time to take a break (US players). |
|
