r****p
发帖数: 1854 | 1 这是我看了这里，以及电视上关于美国各种政治，社会分歧争论的一点浅见。
我觉得，相对意义样的公平（我不觉得有绝对意义上的公平），也是一种“动态平衡”
，是各个社会阶层，立意团体博弈角力的结果--如果这个社会有比较健全的民意表达机
制，各方个面的声音都能在最终的deal里面得到体现的。
当然这个博弈角力的过程要符合游戏规则，而不是像菲律宾那样杀人放火。你对游戏规
则不满，也应该是在尊重规则的前提下钻空子改变规则，比如老墨帮支持移民大赦增加
自己的票仓。
有了以上的想法，我基本上对电视上报纸上各行各派的观点都有一个平常的心态去看待
了。别人都在为自己算计，谁讲普世价值观谁就是 SB。 我这里说的是真讲，而不是像
小左一样拿别人的利益去讲。 |
N********n
发帖数: 8363 | 2
We need to figure out which side is 自私自利 here, the one pays their own
insurance or the one demands other people to pay for their own.
【在 r****p 的大作中提到】
: 这是我看了这里，以及电视上关于美国各种政治，社会分歧争论的一点浅见。
: 我觉得，相对意义样的公平（我不觉得有绝对意义上的公平），也是一种“动态平衡”
: ，是各个社会阶层，立意团体博弈角力的结果--如果这个社会有比较健全的民意表达机
: 制，各方个面的声音都能在最终的deal里面得到体现的。
: 当然这个博弈角力的过程要符合游戏规则，而不是像菲律宾那样杀人放火。你对游戏规
: 则不满，也应该是在尊重规则的前提下钻空子改变规则，比如老墨帮支持移民大赦增加
: 自己的票仓。
: 有了以上的想法，我基本上对电视上报纸上各行各派的观点都有一个平常的心态去看待
: 了。别人都在为自己算计，谁讲普世价值观谁就是 SB。 我这里说的是真讲，而不是像
: 小左一样拿别人的利益去讲。
|
r****p
发帖数: 1854 | 3 从本质上说这两派都是在自私自利的，极端的表现分别是劫富济贫均贫富，和作铁公鸡
一毛不拔。这样对一个社会来说都是灾难，所以需要两边角力得到一个中间值。
【在 N********n 的大作中提到】
:
: We need to figure out which side is 自私自利 here, the one pays their own
: insurance or the one demands other people to pay for their own.
|
m*********a
发帖数: 3299 | 4 this is the point. We use tax to redistribute the wealth. Why do I want to
sacrifice my benefit so you can save more money? No way. You have to
convince 51% to get your agenda passed. Selfish is the norm of and proper
function of a democracy society.
【在 r****p 的大作中提到】
: 从本质上说这两派都是在自私自利的，极端的表现分别是劫富济贫均贫富，和作铁公鸡
: 一毛不拔。这样对一个社会来说都是灾难，所以需要两边角力得到一个中间值。
|
y****t
发帖数: 10233 | 5 is it sustainable? this is the bottom line question.
【在 m*********a 的大作中提到】
: this is the point. We use tax to redistribute the wealth. Why do I want to
: sacrifice my benefit so you can save more money? No way. You have to
: convince 51% to get your agenda passed. Selfish is the norm of and proper
: function of a democracy society.
|
q*c
发帖数: 9453 | 6 who cares - we only see our side :)
LOL
【在 y****t 的大作中提到】
: is it sustainable? this is the bottom line question.
|
y****t
发帖数: 10233 | 7 as long as i dont have to pay, i dont care.
【在 q*c 的大作中提到】
: who cares - we only see our side :)
: LOL
|
m*********a
发帖数: 3299 | 8 This is exactly right. Why have some people had to sacrifice before you? Why
do you sacrifice yourselves for the goodness of this society?
【在 q*c 的大作中提到】
: who cares - we only see our side :)
: LOL
|
r****f
发帖数: 1041 | 9 自私自利的“经济人”是自由社会的基础。
每个人在平等的基础上，通过双方自愿的公平交易来增进自己的福利。
遇到政客号称他要来“无私”地帮助大家，你就要捏紧自己的钱包了。 |
m*********a
发帖数: 3299 | 10 But you have no power to hold your wallet if 51% want your money. They can
legally tax you or you go to jail.
【在 r****f 的大作中提到】
: 自私自利的“经济人”是自由社会的基础。
: 每个人在平等的基础上，通过双方自愿的公平交易来增进自己的福利。
: 遇到政客号称他要来“无私”地帮助大家，你就要捏紧自己的钱包了。
|
|
|
y****t
发帖数: 10233 | 11 that's right, communism is sth like cancer.
once more than half your body is infected by cancer, you cannot really do
anything but die.
heck, you may not even need to have 50% your body infected to get there, as
the matter of fact.
【在 m*********a 的大作中提到】
: But you have no power to hold your wallet if 51% want your money. They can
: legally tax you or you go to jail.
|
m*********a
发帖数: 3299 | 12 This is not the communism. This is the democracy that allows the progress of
the economy benefiting the majority not a selected few. |
r****f
发帖数: 1041 | 13 That's why one person one vote Democracy is a suicidal system.
The founding Fathers knew this so well that they created protection
mechanism in the Constitution, the Bill of Rights!
【在 m*********a 的大作中提到】
: But you have no power to hold your wallet if 51% want your money. They can
: legally tax you or you go to jail.
|
y****t
发帖数: 10233 | 14 cut the crap.
it is benefiting few parasitic class, and go against working majority.
of
【在 m*********a 的大作中提到】
: This is not the communism. This is the democracy that allows the progress of
: the economy benefiting the majority not a selected few.
|
m*********a
发帖数: 3299 | 15 If they could get support of the majority, it could say that the bill
benefited the majority when everyone voted based on his own interest. This
is the idea of democracy.
【在 y****t 的大作中提到】
: cut the crap.
: it is benefiting few parasitic class, and go against working majority.
:
: of
|
a**t
发帖数: 3833 | 16 if one person one vote Democracy is a suicidal system, then one penis on
vote is dream system. Huh?
【在 r****f 的大作中提到】
: That's why one person one vote Democracy is a suicidal system.
: The founding Fathers knew this so well that they created protection
: mechanism in the Constitution, the Bill of Rights!
|
a**t
发帖数: 3833 | 17 I mean on penis one ote is a dream system. One pussy doesn't count at all.
【在 a**t 的大作中提到】
: if one person one vote Democracy is a suicidal system, then one penis on
: vote is dream system. Huh?
|
y****t
发帖数: 10233 | 18 it is not, are you blind?
they can't get majority of support.
once they get majority of support, which could only means one thing, the country is more than half dead, like greece. communism has taken over.
【在 m*********a 的大作中提到】
: If they could get support of the majority, it could say that the bill
: benefited the majority when everyone voted based on his own interest. This
: is the idea of democracy.
|
O*****g
发帖数: 1257 | 19 that's why there should be a flat-tax system. everybody should pay tax, so
when the government raises tax, everybody feels the pinch.
【在 m*********a 的大作中提到】
: But you have no power to hold your wallet if 51% want your money. They can
: legally tax you or you go to jail.
|
