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发帖数: 6361 | 1 http://m.guancha.cn/DonaldTrump/2017_01_19_390251.shtml
【正当全球目光聚焦于中欧的达沃斯时，德国《图片报》与英国《泰晤士报》刊发了对
特朗普的联合专访，在特朗普就职前夕，提供了一个审视其思想的窗口。
特朗普在专访中狠批默克尔的移民政策，大赞英国“脱欧”，引发德国政界强烈反应，
副总理加布里尔呼吁德国人要“自信”。甚至法国总统奥朗德也反击说：“欧盟不需要
外界指点必须怎么做。”
在访谈中，特朗普还扬言，如果在美国销售的宝马汽车产自海外，就要加税。但他同时
又说，德国与中国的“情况不一样”，“大多数贸易逆差来自中国，中国是个大问题”。
特约译者宋武翻译《图片报》访谈全文，以飨读者。】
德国《图片报》主编凯·狄克曼（Kai Diekmann）在唐纳德·特朗普的纽约办公室里采
访了他
记者：候任总统先生，您的祖父来自德国，母亲来自苏格兰。正如您所知，我的同行《
泰晤士报》记者迈克尔是苏格兰人，我是德国人。您将会怎样塑造美国与英德的关系？
特朗普：嗯，以类似的方式。我们热爱这两个国家，它们是伟大的国家，伟大的地区。
英国如何从欧盟退出，是件很令人感兴趣的事情。正如你们所知，我之前或多或少已经
对此有所预言。
我曾经去过特恩贝里（苏格兰西部海滨城市），因为我在那里购买了一个高尔夫球场。
它现在运营得非常好。我要说，你们手里的英镑贬值了，这可是个好事。因为现在英国
的很多地方，各种商业都出乎意料的好。我相信，英国退欧最终将被证明是一件丰功伟
业。
记者：您认为，美国和英国将会很快达成一项贸易协议吗？
特朗普：绝对是，很快就会。我是英国文化的狂热爱好者。我们将努力工作，尽快、合
理地达成这个协议，对于双方来说都是好事。我将会与……如果你们想看那
封信的话，英国首相特蕾莎·梅刚刚寄给我的信在哪儿来着……她邀请与我
会晤，我们将会在我上任后很快会面，我相信，我们将会很快取得一些成果。
记者：您认为英国退欧的原因是什么？
特朗普：英国人不想让其他人来到他们的国家并将它破坏。我将从上任第一天起就致力
于使边境安全。这是我在上任第一天——也就是下周一，而不是本周五或者周六，因为
我不想在盛大的就职典礼时做这些事情——签署的第一批法令之一。
我们不想让那些我们一点不了解背景的叙利亚难民来。对我们而言，没有办法审核这些
人。我不想像德国那样处理难民事务。我非常尊敬默克尔女士，这一点必须说。但是我
认为，在德国发生的事情是非常不幸的。我热爱德国，因为我的父亲来自德国，我不想
让自己也处于类似的境地。正如我认为的那样，我们已经有足够多的问题了。
记者：在竞选时您曾经说过，你想阻止全世界的穆斯林入境美国。您是否还有这个打算？
特朗普：来自世界不同地区的穆斯林都与恐怖主义有所瓜葛。美国将会有非常严格的安
全审核，不会和现在一样。在外国人入境美国时，我们现在没有正确的安全审核，甚至
从严格意义上讲，目前根本不存在安全审核，就像在你们国家，至少过去也是如此。
记者：对于想来到美国的欧洲人，是否也可能设置入境限制？
特朗普：嗯，这是可能会发生的，但是我们将会看看事态的具体发展。我认为，这里说
的是一部分欧洲，世界上一部分地区，我们在那里有些问题，那里的人想来到美国，制
造麻烦。我可不想有这些麻烦。你们看，我是凭借边境安全、贸易和军事这些议题赢得
了大选。我们将会有一支强大的军队。
记者：您提到了，您是德裔。对您来说，血管里流着德国人的血液意味着什么？
特朗普：是的，这是很了不起的事情。我对德国感到非常骄傲，德国是非常特别的。巴
德迪尔克海姆（德国莱茵兰-普法尔茨州的一个小镇，特朗普祖父母的出生地），是吗
？那是真正的德国领土，不是吗？没问题。我热爱德国，我热爱英国。
记者：您曾经去过德国吗？
特朗普：是的，我去过德国。
记者：奥巴马前阵子在即将离任之际访问德国时说，如果有可能的话，他将在德国大选
时投默克尔一票。您也会吗？
特朗普：这个……首先我不知道，她的竞选对手是谁。我也不认识她，从未
与她会面。就像之前所说的，我非常尊敬她。我觉得，她是一个伟大的领导人。但是我
认为，她犯了一个灾难性的错误，也就是让那些非法难民进入德国。
你们知道进入德国的这些难民是从哪里来的吗？没有人知道，他们究竟是从哪里来的。
你们将会发现问题的严重性，对此柏林恐袭已经给了你们一个清晰的印象。
我认为，她犯了一个灾难性的错误，一个非常恶劣的错误。但是除去这一点：我尊敬她
，我欣赏她，但是我还没有与她结识。因此我不能说，我将会支持哪个竞选人，如果我
能给某个人投票的话。
记者：您什么时候将会以总统的身份访问英国？
特朗普：我对此很期待。我的母亲非常讲究礼节，而父亲是很随意的一个人，但我相信
自己有母亲的性格。母亲爱戴英国女王，为女王感到非常骄傲。她喜欢宫廷礼仪，对此
没有人能像英国人做得那么好。她非常尊敬和喜欢女王，每次当女王出现在电视上，她
都会看电视。有些狂热，不是吗？
记者：您从您苏格兰裔的母亲身上还继承了哪些特点？
特朗普：嗯，苏格兰人重视自己的零钱是出了名的，因此我也很重视我的零钱。只有当
我要处理很多零钱时，那才会成为问题。
记者：您身上有什么典型的德国人特点吗？
特朗普：我喜欢秩序。我喜欢井井有条地处理一切。在这一点上，德国人是非常有名的
。但我也是这样，我喜欢秩序，我喜欢力量。
记者：在竞选时您曾经说过，默克尔对待叙利亚难民的政策是“精神错乱”。您还是这
么认为吗？
特朗普：我认为，这不是个好事儿，对德国而言是个严重的错误。尤其是偏偏发生在德
国，德国之前可是世界上入境规定最严格的国家之一。我将会与默克尔女士会面。我尊
敬她，欣赏她。但是我认为，她的难民政策是个错误。人总会犯错的，但这是个非常严
重的错误。
我们本来应该在叙利亚设立安全区，那样所付出的成本要小得多。海湾国家本来应对此
支付资金，他们比谁都有钱。如果早就如此，我们所付出的成本比德国目前所遭受的创
伤要小得多。我曾经说过：在叙利亚设立安全区。
你们看，这整段历史本来就是不应该发生的。伊拉克战争本来就不该发生，不是吗？在
我们国家的历史上，这可能是做出的最错误的决定之一。我们激起了一系列连锁反应，
就像往蜂窝上扔了一块石头一样。现在是历史上最困难的时刻之一。
我刚刚看了一些东西，哦，我不能给你们展示，那可是机密文件。但是我刚刚看了关于
阿富汗的一些文件。如果看一下关于塔利班的文件，根据不同的机密等级，这些文件的
封面分为不同的颜色，每年这样的文件都越来越多。人们就会问：那里到底发生了什么？
记者：您认为责任由谁承担？奥巴马，还是巴基斯坦？您认为谁应对此负责？
特朗普：阿富汗的事态不太妙。那里的一切都不太好。我认为，我们的军队已经在阿富
汗驻扎了将近17年。但是如果人们看一下整个地区，公平地说，我们没有让我们的人做
一些他们本应完成的任务。
我们有一支强大的军队，但它太分散了，现在没让它去取得胜利。正如你们所知，波音
和洛克希德·马丁公司是这个国家的军火巨头，他们的F35项目已经非常非常超支并且
进度拖延，比成本预算超出了上千亿美元，进度落后了七年。情况必须有所改善。
记者：作为美国武装力量的总司令，您的最优先任务是什么？
特朗普：伊斯兰国。
记者：您将会如何处理伊斯兰国问题？
特朗普：对此我现在还不能说，我不愿意像奥巴马或者其他人那样。在这个方面，我肯
定要说一下摩苏尔，摩苏尔如今已经变成一场灾难，血腥的灾难。奥巴马等人在四个月
之前就曾经声明，美国会攻占摩苏尔。我说：“为什么你们要宣告此事？”这是他们自
己的问题：首先要做什么？什么时候开始进攻摩苏尔？他们什么时候做什么，如何做？
他们要使用什么样的武器？在几点钟？
记者：您认为，奥巴马是通过电报宣告了他的进攻计划？
特朗普：摩苏尔已经成为一场灾难，因为我们在五个月前就已经宣布，我们将在五个月
内攻占摩苏尔。在四个月前，我们说：‘我们已经准备好了’，当我们的军队进入摩苏
尔时，对此的报道已经甚嚣尘上了。因此，彻底攻占这座城市就变得非常困难了。
记者：您认为普京对叙利亚的军事干预是好事还是坏事？
特朗普：这是很不好的事情，非常不幸。当我们为美国军事干涉预叙利亚战争划定红线
时，我们本来有机会做些什么，但后来什么也没有做。那本来是唯一的机会，现在为时
已晚。太晚了，时机已经一去不复返了。
归根到底，叙利亚战争终将结束，但是发生在阿勒颇的事情是令人憎恶的。人们看到，
士兵如何枪杀离开这座城市的老年妇女。她们可能只是沿着路边走，就被枪杀了。看起
来就像是他们在那些妇女散步时开枪射击一样，这太可怕了。阿勒颇目前正处于人道主
义的严重危机。
特朗普的写字台。左边是一本小说《美丽国度》，讲述了一位年轻的美国网球选手在中
国的生活经历。
记者：谈到俄罗斯，您知道，默克尔对普京非常了解。普京的德语很好，默克尔则会说
流利的俄语。他们两个人之中您更信任谁：默克尔还是普京？
特朗普：首先要说的是，我对他们两个人都信任，但是我们要看一下，这种信任会持续
多长时间。或许根本不会持续很长时间。
记者：您是否能够理解，东欧人对普京和俄罗斯感到恐惧？
特朗普：当然。是的，我知道这一点。我认为，我理解他们面对的是什么，我很久之前
就曾经说过：北约是有问题的。这个组织已经过时了，首先，正如你们所知道的那样，
它是在很多年以前被设计出来的。其次，很多国家并没有支付他们应当承担的成本。
它确实是过时了，因为它无法处理恐怖主义问题。当我表达了这个观点后，有两天之久
承受了很大压力，然后人们开始说，特朗普是正确的。现在，《华尔街日报》的头版单
独设立了一栏，专门刊登与恐怖主义有关的文章。这是个好事。
另一方面，很多北约国家并没有支付他们的合理份额。当然，我们应保护这些国家，但
其中的很多国家并没有支付他们应当承担的那部分费用。这对美国而言是很不公平的。
但是除去这一点，我认为北约是非常重要的。
记者：英国支付的费用够吗？
特朗普：英国当然交够钱了。有5个国家足额交付了他们应当承担的费用。只有5个。对
于北约22个成员国来说，真不多。
记者：近几十年来，欧洲在安全防务方面一直依赖美国。将来还会有这样的安全承诺吗？
特朗普：当然，我与欧洲生息与共，紧密相连，是这样的。
记者：您是否支持欧洲对俄罗斯的制裁政策？
特朗普：我认为人们必须和睦相处，做一些为了公平起见必须要做的事情。是这样吧？
你们国家对俄罗斯采取了制裁措施，现在看一下，我们是否可以与俄罗斯做一些好交易
。我认为世界上的核武器应该少得多，必须进行大幅削减。但是这些制裁措施制造了障
碍，而且俄罗斯深受其苦。但是我认为，在这方面会有一些进展的，很多人会从中受益。
记者：您会撕毁伊朗核协议吗？
特朗普：我不会说，将对伊朗核协议做些什么。我不会让人看我的底牌。你们看，我就
不是政客，我不会走到外面对着记者说：“我要做这个，我要做那个……”
我必须做我认为应该做的事情。谁会在牌局结束之前向别人展示，他手里有什么牌？
但是我对伊朗核协议感觉不好，我觉得，这是历史上达成的最糟糕的协议之一。从商业
角度来说也是非常不利：如果你们向一个国家返还1500亿美元（解冻资金），如果你们
向它支付17亿美元的赔偿……你们是否曾经见过百元大钞堆起来的100万美
元？那可是很大一堆。这是一个非常非常大的数字。17亿美元的现金赔偿。那就要用飞
机来装运了。什么，一架飞机？要很多架。
17亿美元，我对此完全不能理解。这只是展示了总统的权力。如果这个国家的总统可以
允许从国库支出17亿美元，这就是一个非常大的权力。
记者：您认为，伊朗会用这些钱资助恐怖主义吗？
特朗普：不会的。我认为，这笔钱现在还在瑞士银行的账户上。伊朗不需要这笔钱，他
们用的是其他资金。我认为，他们已经收到了钱，并且没有声张。这就是我的观点。
记者：对于联合国安理会在圣诞节前不久作出的涉及以色列的决议，您怎样看待奥巴马
在此事上的立场？
特朗普：这太可怕了。他本来应该投否决票的。
记者：您认为，英国本来也应该投否决票的？
特朗普：英国将很快有机会行使否决权，如果我没记错的话：本周末将会有一次国际会
议（译者注：在巴黎召开由相关国家外长参加的中东和平会议）。现在流传着很多不好
的事情。我的问题是，因为事先已经给了巴勒斯坦人很多许诺，对我而言谈判就会变得
很难。这一切虽然在法律上没有约束力，但是在心理上给我的谈判增加了难度。你们理
解这一点吗？这些人放弃了所有的谈判筹码。
记者：您是否认为，英国应该拒绝联合国安理会本周提交的、涉及以色列的任何决议，
这样您才有一个更好的谈判出发点，能够为中东地区达成一个好的协议？
特朗普：我希望英国行使否决权。我认为，如果英国投否决票，那将是很了不起的，因
为令人惊讶的是，我不确定美国是否会这么做。他们不会投反对票，是吗？你们是否认
为，美国会行使否决权？我有一个犹太裔朋友，正在组织一个为奥巴马筹款的活动。我
对他说：“你们在那里做什么？好吧，你们在那里做什么？”
记者：您是否要将美国大使馆从特拉维夫迁址到耶路撒冷？
特朗普：对此我现在不会发表意见，但是我们将关注事态的发展。
记者：您是否知道基辛格的一句名言：“如果我想给欧洲打电话，该打给谁呢？”在这
种情况下，您会给谁打电话？
特朗普：我要说的是，默克尔绝对是世界上最重要的政府首脑之一，远超同侪。你们看
一下英国，看一下欧盟，欧盟就是德国。从本质上来讲，欧盟就是德国为了达到自己目
的的一个工具。因此我认为，英国退出欧盟是一个明智的决定。
你们也有过这样的报导，在头版写过：“特朗普说，英国将会退出欧盟。”当时事态看
起来还完全不是那样，你们知道，所有人当时都认为我疯了。奥巴马当时说，如果英国
离开欧盟，就得在与美国的跨大西洋贸易与投资伙伴协议（TTIP）谈判中“靠后站”。
发表这样的见解，是很不合时宜的。我认为，你们做得很对。我认为，正在进行的英国
退欧非常伟大。
记者：您如何看待欧盟的未来？您是否认为，还会有更多国家退出欧盟？
特朗普：这很难。我曾经与欧盟委员会主席通过电话，他是一位非常和蔼的先生。
记者：容克先生？
特朗普：是的，他恭贺我当选。我认为这是非常困难的：无论是人还是国家都想要自己
的认同感，英国人想要他们自己的认同感。但我确实认为，他们如果不是被迫接收所有
这些难民——数量实在太多了，带来了很多问题——那么英国退欧就不会发生。本来退
欧留欧两派局面焦灼，但是难民问题成为压倒骆驼的最后一根稻草。如果你们现在问我
这个问题，我的回答就是：今后还将有国家退出欧盟。
记者：作为成功的商人，您是否信任欧洲货币？
特朗普：是的，欧元非常好。我指的是，你们信任什么？我信任美元。在今后四年，我
将给美元比今天更多的信任，很明显，美元非常坚挺。但我相信，保持欧元的地位将不
会很轻松，不像很多人以为的那样。如果继续有难民涌入欧洲各地，那将很难维持欧元
的稳定，因为这种货币激怒了人们。
特朗普在他的纽约办公室里收集了著名运动员的一些物品，其中的世界冠军腰带是泰森
的。
记者：强大的欧盟或更强大的民族国家，哪一个对美国是更好的？
特朗普：我不认为这会对美国产生很大影响，我从不认为这有什么意义。你们看，建立
欧盟的部分原因是为了在贸易上打击美国，不是这样吗？因此，欧盟究竟是分裂还是统
一，我根本毫不关心，对我没有任何影响。
我在爱尔兰的敦贝格有一块很大的产业，一个风光秀丽的房地产项目。曾经发生了这样
的事情：为了对这个地产项目进行大规模的扩建，我申请了一项许可——当时我还是一
个房地产开发商，现在当然对我来说已经完全无所谓了。我从这件事学到了很多，因为
虽然我很快就得到爱尔兰的许可，但爱尔兰政府和我的人还要去征求欧盟的许可。这个
过程要持续好几年，对于爱尔兰来说这太不好了。
记者：您认为，欧盟阻碍了其成员国的发展？欧盟对于经济增长和富裕是否构成了障碍？
特朗普：欧盟官方以环保为借口阻碍那个项目的建设。对我而言，那是一个非常不快的
经历。欧盟许可的申请程序持续了好几年。于是我做了什么？我就说：忘了它吧，我不
在这里做房地产了.
记者：在欧盟和其他国家，人们担心美国可能会采取贸易保护主义政策，给美国的朋友
带来损害。对于这些人，您会说什么？
特朗普：我认为，我做的已经超过之前任何一位候任总统了。很多想选址在其他国家的
工厂和汽车厂，现在想在美国建厂，或者是密歇根州，或者是俄亥俄州。福特要重回美
国放弃在墨西哥建厂，菲亚特-克莱斯勒宣布了在美国建厂的计划，通用汽车也有类似
计划，我在这里谈的不仅仅是汽车厂，还会有很多其他行业。
人们不会允许企业离开我们的国家，抛弃员工，迁到墨西哥生产，然后免税地把产品卖
回美国，就像现在这样。对于这么做的企业，我们将会征收很高的边境税。如果企业听
到这一点，他们就会说：要不我们留在美国吧。但是如果他们离开，在外国建立汽车厂
或者空调厂，然后想将他们的产品卖到美国，那么他们将面临35%的边境税。但是最终
不会有这样的税负发生，因为企业根本没有离开美国。
保守派想要开放边境，这很好，很美丽。这对于安全很糟糕，但对贸易是个好事。只是
在贸易方面，美国始终被人利用，这是个问题。我们与中国的贸易逆差每年有上千亿美
元。在全世界范围内，我们的贸易逆差每年达到8050亿美元。如果失去了这么多钱，那
么你们告诉我，谁愿意做这样的生意？
记者：现在，德国明显从中受益很多，因为我们是世界出口冠军。
特朗普：是的，你们非常善于出口。我们买了很多你们的汽车。
记者：欧洲是否要担心将会面临高额关税，就像您对中国所宣布的那样？
特朗普：情况会不一样。我认为，德国是一个伟大的国家，一个伟大的制造业国家。如
果有人在纽约第五大道上走，就会看到几乎每座楼前都停着一辆梅赛德斯奔驰轿车，不
是吗？事实是，你们对美国非常不公平。在这方面没有做到互惠互利。你们在德国能看
到多少雪佛兰轿车？不是很多，或许根本没有，德美贸易是一条单行线。必须进行双向
的贸易。
我想，必须互惠互利才是公平的，你们想一下，我们的逆差每年有8000亿欧元，这种局
面必须停止。我的内阁团队里有威尔伯·罗斯（Wilbur Ross，拟任商务部长）。我得
说，大多数贸易逆差来自中国，中国是个大问题。
特朗普在看狄克曼送给他的礼物：一块柏林墙的原件。在这块水泥上有德国前任首相科
尔、苏联领导人戈尔巴乔夫和美国前总统乔治布什的签名。
记者：您刚才提到了奔驰、宝马甚至大众，您希望这些企业今后更多地在美国建厂吗？
例如宝马将于2019年在墨西哥开设一家工厂。
特朗普：我将会对他们说，他们不应该浪费时间和金钱，除非他们想把产品销往别的国
家，那么在墨西哥建厂就没有问题了。我喜欢墨西哥，我喜欢墨西哥总统，我喜欢那里
的人民，但我要对宝马说，如果他们想在墨西哥建厂，把产品卖到美国而不面临35%的
边境税，那是不可能的。如果他们想把那里生产的汽车销往全世界，那么祝他们一切顺
利。他们可以卖回美国，但对于这样进入美国的每辆汽车，我们都要征收35%的边境税
。我要说的是，他们必须在美国建厂生产，这对于他们，对于我们双方的努力将会好得
多。
或许更重要的是，我们将企业所得税消减四分之三，从35%降低到15%或者20%，最终的
数字我们还没有确定，但是在15%到20%之间。通过趋势的逆转，企业将把他们的钱带回
美国。
记者：这样做会打击谷歌这样的企业吗？
特朗普：有些人说我们有2.5万亿到3万亿美元的资金在国外，但是我想，总共有5万亿
。企业可以不把他们的钱拿回来。但这是我们税法的一部分，让税收回流。
记者：鉴于您对自由贸易的观点，是否可以说您是一位保守派？
特朗普：我是实用主义者。你们看，我出现在大批群众面前，在竞选总统时我曾经有大
规模的群众集会。当我在党内初选与杰布·布什（Jeb Bush）竞争时，把他称为“低能
量杰布”(low-energy Jeb)，因为他曾经说：“唐纳德·特朗普不是保守派。”
当我出现在25000名群众面前，或者就像在密歇根州一样，那里的群众集会足有32000人
，我大声说：“杰布·布什说了，我不是保守派。”群众的回应是：“谁会关心这个！
”然后我说：“你们想要什么？一位保守派总统，还是一个能够带来公平贸易的人？”
杰布·布什曾经说，我不是保守派，因为我不相信自由贸易。我相信自由贸易，我喜欢
自由贸易，但必须是明智的贸易，我称之为公平的。
群众的回应是：“公平贸易，公平贸易！”对他们来说候选人是哪一派根本无所谓，他
们不给候选人贴标签。也就是说，谁会关心这个？
我是一个保守派，但我真正关切的是，为美国人民谈判出公平的贸易条件，使他们能够
找到工作。对于美国人民来说，你是什么派别根本无所谓，他们想要好的贸易条件。知
道吗？他们想让工作机会重回美国。
记者：您是否有偶像？是否有英雄人物是您行为处事的榜样，是否有过去的人物让您敬
仰？
特朗普：嗯，我不喜欢英雄人物，我不喜欢英雄人物的思想，但是人们当然可以尊敬一
些人。
我从父亲身上学到了很多，他是在纽约布鲁克林区和皇后区的建筑商。他建造了很多大
楼和住宅。我从他身上学到了很多谈判技巧，尽管我同时相信，谈判是一项与生俱来的
本能。我认为，有人或者有这个能力，或者就根本没有。有人的水平会提高，但是从根
本上讲，我认识的那些谈判高手、商贾巨头或者伟大的政治家，在他们身上表现得非常
明显——天生的才能。
我曾经接到过一封信，上面说，您所做的事令人惊讶，因为您从来不是一位政客，却打
败所有的政客，赢得了大选。他说，那些人曾经计算过：在竞选开始三个月后，他们曾
经计算过，我只有三个月的政治经验，而我所面对的17个共和党党内竞选人，总共有
236年的从政经历。也就是说，我是三个月，他们是236年。
这是封非常有趣的书信，但是我相信，这就有点儿像击中一个棒球，或者一个优秀的高
尔夫球手一样。对我来说，天分比经验重要得多，经验当然是好事：我觉得，经验丰富
是了不起的，但是我从父亲身上学到了很多领导才能。
记者：您的“美国优先”政策意味着，您同意让世界其他地区受损。是这样吗？
特朗普：我不想造成世界的分裂，我爱这个世界，我想让全世界都好，但是我们不能&#
8230;…我的意思是，你们看一下，我的国家正在遭受什么。我们有20万亿美元的
国债，我们不知道自己正在做什么，武装力量疲弱不堪，我们身处没有任何人能够结束
的战争，军队已经在阿富汗驻扎了17年，这是我们经历的时间最长的战争。
记者：这个星期关于您与新闻媒体关系的报导说明了什么？
特朗普：嗯，他们需要正确的人选。你们认识麦克·蓬佩奥（Mike Pompeo），他确实
受人尊敬，工作出色，将会成为中情局的局长。我相信，我们已经有了几个非常好的人
选，现在将加入我的内阁。我对新闻媒体非常尊重，但是他们发布了很多谣言，很多“
假新闻”，非常多的“假新闻”。
记者：有报导称，一位前任英国外交官与此事（译者注：特朗普在莫斯科丽思卡尔顿饭
店里的招妓传言）有关。您是否认为，英国必须更仔细地审查本国的新闻媒体？
特朗普：嗯，您们应该审查的这个爆料人就是这样，因为他对我的凭空想象是错误的。
据说他是由合作起来的共和党人和民主党人雇用的。即使我也不相信，因为他们没有合
作，他们是分开的，不会雇用同一个人。如果要合作，他们能怎么办呢？你们看，整件
事就是“假新闻”。因为他通过新闻媒体说，他是共和党人和民主党人的一个特工。但
是他们从未合作。
记者：您认为，隐藏在这一切之后的势力是什么？
特朗普：我认为，有可能是新闻媒体，有可能是民主党人。当我听说这件事时，就把报
纸撕了。如果我在一家酒店里做了所有这些事情，那就是件大事，我就会出现在《纽约
时报》的头版头条，不是吗？完全不是这样。我不能，我也不想与这些人握手言和。现
在，当我听到了这个无稽之谈，根本不会。
这是假新闻，完全是杜撰的，我刚刚收到了一封和我一起去俄罗斯旅行的朋友的邮件。
他们都是富翁，那次旅行时和我一起，他们说和我一直在一起，我从来没有一个人独处
。当时我出去了，我不在酒店里。我当时去是为组织环球小姐竞选活动，起床后，处理
好我的事务就离开莫斯科了。即使这个爆料人是个英国人，他也有很多问题。
记者：美国总统这个职位会对您的工作方式产生哪些影响？
特朗普：这是一个非常大的变化。我之前过着很舒适的生活，成功、富裕，而现在完全
不一样了。但是我想：如果你是总统，如果你入主白宫，那是一个非常特别的地方。你
只能在这里住有限的时间，谁会愿意离开这里呢？奥巴马总统也不想。他非常和蔼可亲
，是的，他在与我私人会谈时非常和蔼。但谁会愿意离开，到别的什么地方去度假呢？
白宫是非常特别的，有很多工作要做，我不会经常离开白宫的。我会在白宫里居住、工
作，完成我的任务，谁会喜欢离开白宫呢？
记者：人们说，戴维营非常漂亮。
特朗普：是的，戴维营很有乡村风格，风景秀丽，让人愉悦。你们知道多长时间就会让
人喜欢上那里？大约三十分钟。
记者：您就职后，是否还会总是发推特？如果是的话，您的账号是“The Real Donald
Trump（真实的特朗普）”、“POTUS（美国总统）”还是“Real POTUS（真实的美国总
统）”？
特朗普：我想，还是@RealDonaldTrump，我保留这个账号。我现在有4600万关注者，这
个数字真的很大，包括了脸书（Facebook）、推特（Twitter）和Instagram。想到有
4600万关注者，我就更希望这个数字继续增长，保留@RealDonaldTrump这个账号，因为
它确实起作用。
至于发推特？我想，我会有所克制，但是媒体对我的报道非常不诚实，因此我通过推特
发表自己的见解。现在的限制不是140个字符,而是280个，我可以梆梆梆地敲字，继续
发推特，媒体一旦发出关于我的不实消息，我就可以立刻在推特上回应。今天早上福克
斯（Fox）电视台说，“唐纳德·特朗普，我们有突发新闻！”然后我就发了条推特。
记者：你今天早晨发了很多推特吗？
特朗普：是的，我发了几条推特。
记者：你是自己发的吗？
特朗普：我发了关于新闻媒体的推特，因为所有这些都已经证明是假消息。
记者：你是用手机发的吗？
特朗普：就是这台手机。但是我还有几台……
记者：但是没有人知道，是否有别人登录您的推特账户。
特朗普：不，这件事我从来是自己做。我有一两个人，他们每天负责这个工作。我把想
说的口授下来，他们打字。
记者：也就是斯蒂夫·班农（Steve Bannon，特朗普的首席策略师、高级顾问）或者其
他人？
特朗普：不，不是斯蒂夫，我还有做这件事的其他人。但推特很有趣的，因为我觉得它
非常准确。如果我想公开说些什么，对报纸说了一些话，而报纸没有准确地表达出来，
这就太糟糕了。
你们可能也不是很反对：如果发推特的话，我对此很小心，文字都非常精确，就像是媒
体上的突发新闻一样字斟句酌。
有趣的是，如果我召开了一次媒体发布会，宣布了一些事情，不会那么快就达到宣传效
果，或许要到第二天。而且如果我要召开一次新闻发布会，那也有大量的工作。
记者：您的女婿杰里德·卡什诺（Jared Kushner）将会担任什么职务？
特朗普：你们知道吗？杰里德是一个好小伙子，他将促成一份关于以色列的协议，是除
此之外任何人不能做到的。他是一个天才，无与伦比。你们知道我说的是什么？天才，
他有着杰出的能力，能够达成协议，所有人都喜欢他。
记者：您的女儿伊万卡也会在政府中担任要职吗？
特朗普：哦，不是现在。她正要去华盛顿，她正要在那里买一座房子。但他们有孩子，
因此杰里德有些牵挂，就像我们宣布的那样。没有薪酬，完全没有。如果他促成了和平
协议，谁会比杰里德更擅长这个事，不是吗？他天赋异禀。 | T*********I
发帖数: 10729 | 2 附上英文：
https://justpaste.it/12goy
This is the full transcript of Donald Trump’s interview with Michael Gove
and Kai Diekmann, former chief editor of the German newspaper Bild.
Mr President-elect, your grandfather is from Germany, your mother is from
Scotland. As you know, Michael is Scottish, I am German. How will you manage
relations with our countries?
Trump: Well, it’s similar. We have great love for both countries. These are
great countries, great places. It’s very interesting how the UK broke away
. I sort of, as you know, predicted it. I was in Turnberry and was doing a
ribbon cutting because I bought Turnberry, which is doing unbelievably, and
I’ll tell you, the fact that your pound sterling has gone down? Great.
Because business is unbelievable in a lot of parts in the UK, as you know. I
think Brexit is going to end up being a great thing.
So do you think we will be able to get a trade deal between the US and the
UK quite quickly?
Absolutely, very quickly. I’m a big fan of the UK, uh, we’re gonna work
very hard to get it done quickly and done properly — good for both sides. I
will be meeting with [Theresa May] — in fact if you want you can see the
letter, wherever the letter is, she just sent it.
She’s requesting a meeting and we’ll have a meeting right after I get into
the White House and it’ll be, I think we’re gonna get something done very
quickly.
Why do you think Brexit happened?
People don’t want to have other people coming in and destroying their
country and you know in this country we’re gonna go very strong borders
from the day I get in. One of the first orders I’m gonna sign – day one –
which I will consider to be Monday as opposed to Friday or Saturday. Right?
I mean my day one is gonna be Monday because I don’t want to be signing
and get it mixed up with lots of celebration, but one of the first orders we
’re gonna be signing is gonna be strong borders.
We don’t want people coming in from Syria who we don’t know who they are.
You know there’s no way of vetting these people. I don’t want to do what
Germany did.
And I’ve great respect for Merkel, by the way, I have to say. I have great
respect for her. But, I, I think it was, I think it was very unfortunate
what happened.
And you know I have a love for Germany because my father came from Germany
and, I don’t want to be in that position. You know the way I look at it, we
have enough problems.
You said during the campaign that you’d like to stop Muslims coming to the
US. Is that still your plan?
Well, from various parts of the world that have lots of terrorism problems.
There will be extreme vetting, it’s not gonna be like it is now, they don’
t even, we don’t even have real vetting. The vetting into this country is
essentially non-existent as it is, as it was at least, with your country.
Are there any travel restrictions that could be imposed on Europeans coming
to the US?
Well, it could happen, I mean we’re gonna have to see. I mean, we’re
looking at parts of Europe; parts of the world and parts of Europe, where we
have problems where they come in and they’re gonna be causing problems. I
don’t wanna have those problems. Look, I won the election because of strong
borders and trade. And military, we’re gonna have strong military.
You mentioned you have German ancestors. What does it mean for you to have
German blood in your veins?
Well, it’s great. I mean, I’m very proud of Germany and Germany is very
special Bad Dürkheim, right? This is serious Germany, right? Like this isn
’t any question — this is serious Germany. No, I’m very proud of Germany.
I love Germany, I love the UK.
Have you ever been to Germany?
Yes, I have been to Germany.
When Obama came for his last visit to Berlin, he said that if he could vote
in the upcoming election he would vote for Angela Merkel. Would you?
Well, I don’t know who she’s running against, number one, I’m just saying
, I don’t know her, I’ve never met her. As I said, I’ve had great respect
for her. I felt she was a great, great leader. I think she made one very
catastrophic mistake and that was taking all of these illegals, you know
taking all of the people from wherever they come from. And nobody even knows
where they come from. You’ll find out, you got a big dose of it a week ago
. So I think she made a catastrophic mistake, very bad mistake. Now, with
that being said, I respect her, I like her, but I don’t know her. So I can
’t talk about who I’m gonna be backing — if anyone.
When are you coming to the UK as president?
I look forward to doing it. My mother was very ceremonial, I think that’s
where I got this aspect because my father was very brick-and-mortar, he was
like, and my mother sort of had a flair, she loved the Queen, she loved
anything — she was so proud of the Queen. She loved the ceremonial and the
beauty, cause nobody does that like the English. And she had great respect
for the Queen, liked her. Anytime the Queen was on television, an event, my
mother would be watching. Crazy, right?
Is there anything else you take from having a Scottish mother?
Well, the Scottish are known for watching their pennies, so I like to watch
my pennies — I mean I deal in big pennies, that’s the problem.
Is there anything typically German about you?
I like order. I like things done in an orderly manner. And certainly the
Germans, that’s something that they’re rather well known for. But I do, I
like order and I like strength.
In your campaign you said Angela Merkel’s policy on Syrian refugees was
insane. Do you still think so?
I think it’s not good. I think it was a big mistake for Germany. And
Germany of all countries, ’cause Germany was one of the toughest in the
world for having anybody go in, and, uh, no I think it was a mistake. And I
’ll see her and I’ll meet her and I respect her. And I like her but I
think it was a mistake. And people make mistakes but I think it was a very
big mistake. I think we should have built safe zones in Syria. Would have
been a lot less expensive. Uh, get the Gulf states to pay for ’em who aren
’t coming through, I mean they’ve got money that nobody has.
Would have been a lot less expensive than the trauma that Germany’s going
through now — but I would have said — you build safe zones in Syria. Look,
this whole thing should have never happened. Iraq should not have been
attacked in the first place, all right? It was one of the worst decisions,
possibly the worst decision ever made in the history of our country. We’ve
unleashed — it’s like throwing rocks into a beehive. It’s one of the
great messes of all time. I looked at something, uh, I’m not allowed to
show you because it’s classified – but, I just looked at Afghanistan and
you look at the Taliban – and you take a look at every, every year its more
, more, more, you know they have the different colours – and you say, you
know – what’s going on?
Who do you blame? Obama, Pakistan? Who do you blame?
Afghanistan is, is not going well. Nothing’s going well — I guess we’ve
been in Afghanistan almost 17 years — but you look at all of the places,
now in all fairness, we haven’t let our people do what they’re supposed to
do. You know we have great military, we’re gonna have much greater
military because we’re gonna have — you know right now it’s very depleted
, we’re gonna have great military, but we haven’t let our military win.
Boeing and Lockheed Martin are you know big contractors for this country and
we have an F-35 program that has been very, very severely over budget and
behind schedule. Hundreds of billions of dollars over budget and seven years
behind schedule. And, uh, they got to shape up.
And what’s your priority for the military as commander-in-chief?
Isis.
And how are you going to deal with Isis?
Well, I’d rather not say, I don’t want to be like Obama or others where
they say — I always talk about Mosul, you know Mosul’s turned out to be a
disas — brutal. So Mosul, so they announced four months ago we’re going to
attack Mosul — I said, “Why do you have to announce it?”. Like you said,
“What’s going to be your priority?”. When are you going to attack? When
are you gonna, how are you gonna do it? What kind of weapons are you gonna
use, right? What time of the day?
You think Obama telegraphed his punch?
Mosul turned out to be a disaster because we announced five months ago that
we were going into Mosul, in five months. In four months we said, “We’re
getting ready”, by the time we get in, it’s been so much talk — and it’s
been very hard to take — you know that, right?
Do you think that what’s happened in Syria now with Putin intervening is a
good thing or a bad thing?
Nah, I think it’s a very rough thing. It’s a very bad thing, we had a
chance to do something when we had the line in the sand and it wasn’t —
nothing happened. That was the only time — and now, it’s sort of very late
. It’s too late. Now everything is over — at some point it will come to an
end — but Aleppo was nasty. I mean when you see them shooting old ladies
walking out of town — they can’t even walk and they’re shooting ’em —
it almost looks like they’re shooting ’em for sport — ah no, that’s a
terrible — that’s been a terrible situation. Aleppo has been such a
terrible humanitarian situation.
Talking about Russia, you know that Angela Merkel understands Putin very
well because he is fluent in German, she is fluent in Russian, and they have
known each other for a long time — but who would you trust more, Angela
Merkel or Vladimir Putin?
Well, I start off trusting both — but let’s see how long that lasts. It
may not last long at all.
Can you understand why eastern Europeans fear Putin and Russia?
Sure. Oh sure, I know that. I mean, I understand what’s going on, I said a
long time ago — that Nato had problems. Number one it was obsolete, because
it was, you know, designed many, many years ago. Number two — the
countries aren’t paying what they’re supposed to pay. I took such heat,
when I said Nato was obsolete. It’s obsolete because it wasn’t taking care
of terror. I took a lot of heat for two days. And then they started saying
Trump is right — and now — it was on the front page of The Wall Street
Journal, they have a whole division devoted now to terror, which is good.
And the other thing is the countries aren’t paying their fair share so we’
re supposed to protect countries but a lot of these countries aren’t paying
what they’re supposed to be paying, which I think is very unfair to the
United States. With that being said, Nato is very important to me.
Britain is paying.
Britain is paying. There’s five countries that are paying what they’re
supposed to. Five. It’s not much, from 22.
For decades now, Europe has depended on America for its defence. Will that
guarantee be there in the future as well?
Yeah, I feel very strongly toward Europe — very strongly toward Europe, yes.
Do you support European sanctions against Russia?
Well, I think you know — people have to get together and people have to do
what they have to do in terms of being fair. OK? They have sanctions on
Russia — let’s see if we can make some good deals with Russia. For one
thing, I think nuclear weapons should be way down and reduced very
substantially, that’s part of it. But you do have sanctions and Russia’s
hurting very badly right now because of sanctions, but I think something can
happen that a lot of people are gonna benefit.
Will you rip up the Iran deal?
Well, I don’t want to say what I’m gonna do with the Iran deal. I just don
’t want to play the cards. I mean, look, I’m not a politician, I don’t go
out and say, ‘I’m gonna do this — I’m gonna do —’, I gotta do what I
gotta do. But I don’t wanna play. Who plays cards where you show everybody
the hand before you play it? But I’m not happy with the Iran deal, I think
it’s one of the worst deals ever made, I think it’s one of the dumbest
deals I’ve ever seen, one of the dumbest, in terms of a deal. Where you
give — where you give a $150 billion back to a country, where you give $1.7
billion in cash — did you ever see a million dollars in hundred dollar
bills? It’s a lot. It’s a whole — it’s a lot. $1.7 billion in cash.
Plane loads. Of, of — think of it — plane, many planes. Boom. $1.7 billion
. I don’t understand. It just shows the power of a president — when a
president of this country can authorise $1.7 billion in cash, that’s a lot
of power.
And you think that money is now funding terror?
No, I think that money is in Swiss bank accounts — they don’t need that
money, they’re using other money, I think they’ve taken that money and
they’ve kept it for themselves. That’s my opinion.
What did you think of Obama’s approach towards the UN Security Council
resolution on Israel just before Christmas?
I think it was terrible. It should have been a veto. I think it was terrible.
Do you think the UK should have vetoed it?
Well, the UK may have another chance to veto if what I’m hearing is true,
because you know you have a meeting as you know, this weekend. And there are
a lot of bad stories being circulated. The problem I have is that it makes
it a tougher deal for me to negotiate because the Palestinians are given so
much — even though it’s not legally binding it’s psychologically binding
and it makes it much tougher for me to negotiate. You understand that?
Because people are giving away chips, they’re giving away all these chips.
And do you think the UK should veto any UN Security Council resolution on
Israel put forward this week so that you are in a stronger position to get
the right deal for the Middle East?
Well, I’d like to see the UK veto. I think it’d be great if they veto
because I’m not sure the United States is gonna veto, amazingly. They won’
t, right? You think the United States is gonna veto? I’ll have friends who
are Jewish have a fundraiser for Obama and I’ll say, “What are you doing?
OK — what are you doing?”
Is it true you’re going to move the American embassy from Tel Aviv to
Jerusalem?
Well, I don’t want to comment on that, again, but we’ll see what happens.
You know that famous saying by Henry Kissinger: “Which number do I dial if
I want to talk to Europe?” Which number are you going to dial?
Yeah, well I would say Merkel is by far one of the most important leaders.
’Cause you look at the UK and you look at the European Union and it’s
Germany. Basically a vehicle for Germany. That’s why I thought the UK was
so smart in getting out and you were there and you guys wrote it — put it
on the front page: “Trump said that Brexit is gonna happen”. That was when
it was gonna lose easily, you know, everybody thought I was crazy. Obama
said to go to the back of the line. Meaning, if it does happen — and then
he had to retract — that was a bad statement to make.
I think you’re doing great. I think it’s going great.
What is your view on the future of the European Union? Do you expect more
countries to leave the European Union?
I think it’s tough. I spoke to the head of the European Union, very fine
gentleman called me up.
Mr Juncker?
Yes, ah, to congratulate me on what happened with respect to the election.
Uh, I think it’s very tough. I think it’s tough. People, countries want
their own identity and the UK wanted its own identity but, I do believe this
, if they hadn’t been forced to take in all of the refugees, so many, with
all the problems that it, you know, entails, I think that you wouldn’t have
a Brexit. It probably could have worked out but, this was the final straw,
this was the final straw that broke the camel’s back.
I think people want, people want their own identity, so if you ask me,
others, I believe others will leave.
As a successful businessman, do you trust the European currency?
Well, it’s doing OK. I mean, you know. What do you trust? I trust the
dollar, I’m gonna trust the dollar a lot more in four years than I do now,
but sure I mean it’s a currency, it’s fine. But I do think keeping it
together is not gonna be as easy as a lot of people think. And I think this,
if refugees keep pouring into different part of Europe. I think it’s gonna
be very hard to keep it together cause people are angry about it.
What is better for the United States — a strong European Union or stronger
nation states?
Personally, I don’t think it matters much for the United States. I never
thought it mattered. Look, the EU was formed, partially, to beat the United
States on trade, OK? So, I don’t really care whether it’s separate or
together, to me it doesn’t matter. I can see this — I own a big property
in Ireland, magnificent property called Doonbeg, what happened is I went for
an approval to do this massive, beautiful expansion — that was when I was
a developer, now I couldn’t care less about it — but I learnt a lot
because I got the approvals very quickly from Ireland and then Ireland and
my people went to the EU to get the approval — it was going to take years
— that was a very bad thing for Ireland.
Do you think that the EU is holding back all its member states? Is it an
obstacle to their growth and prosperity?
Well I can tell you from the environmental standpoint, they were using
environmental tricks to stop a project from being built — I found it to be
a very unpleasant experience. To get the approvals from the EU would have
taken years — I don’t think that’s good for a country like Ireland so you
know what I did? I said forget it I’m not gonna build it.
People in Europe and beyond have expressed concern that America may have a
protectionist trade policy that will hurt America’s friends. What would you
say to them?
Well, I can tell you that in the last … I think I’ve done more than any
president-elect ever — Many factories now, many car plants, that were going
to be built in other locations are building in Michigan and Ohio — ya know
Ford announced a big one, Fiat Chrysler announced a big one, General Motors
is announcing, they’re all announcing and I’m not just talking about cars
I’m talking about other things, there will be many other things — you can
’t allow companies to leave our country, fire all of its employees, move to
Mexico, make whatever the product is, and then sell it back in with no tax
— and there will be a very substantial border tax for companies that do
that. And when people hear that — they say we’re gonna stay here or we’re
gonna build in the US — so they’ll go and they’ll build their car plant
or they’ll build their air-conditioning plant and they’re gonna sell their
air conditioners but they’re gonna pay 35 per cent tax . . . there’s not
gonna be any tax because they’re not gonna leave — see there’s not gonna
be any tax — but the conservative theory is open borders, open borders is
all fine. First of all it’s bad for security — for trade it’s fine — the
problem is the US is always taken advantage of — we have hundreds of
billions of dollars of trade deficits with China — we have $805 billion in
trade deficits with the world — ya almost say, who’s making these deals
when you’re losing that kind of money, right — we actually have almost $
800 billion — almost $800 billion in trade deficits with the world — so
you say, who’s making these deals?
Well, Germany is obviously benefiting because we are the world champions at
exporting?
Well you’re very good at export — we buy lots of your cars.
Do Europeans have to fear something similar to what you might announce for
China — higher custom duties?
It’s going to be different — I mean Germany is a great country, great
manufacturing country — you go down Fifth Avenue everybody has a Mercedes-
Benz in front of their building, right — the fact is that it’s been very
unfair to the US, it’s not a two-way street. How many Chevrolets do you see
in Germany? Maybe none — not too many — how many — you don’t see
anything over there — it’s a one-way street — it’s gotta be a two-way
street — I want it to be fair but it’s gotta be a two-way street and that
’s why we’re losing almost $800, think of it, $800 billion a year in trade
so that will stop — ya know we have Wilbur [Ross, his choice for commerce
secretary] as one of our guys, ya know Wilbur . . .
And I will say most of it . . . most of it is China ’cause China is a
tremendous problem.
You just mentioned Mercedes, BMW, even VW — do you expect them to build
more plants in the US? For example, BMW wants to open a plant in 2019 in
Mexico . . .
I would tell them, don’t waste their time and money — unless they want to
sell to other countries, that’s fine — if they want to open in Mexico, I
love Mexico, I like the president, I like everybody — but I would tell BMW
if they think they’re gonna build a plant in Mexico and sell cars into the
US without a 35 per cent tax, it’s not gonna happen, it’s not gonna happen
— so if they want to build cars for the world I would say wish them luck
— they can build cars for the US but they’ll be paying a 35 per cent tax
on every car that comes into the country . . . so what I’m saying is they
have to build their plant in the US, it will be much better for them and
what we’re doing — maybe more importantly, is we’re lowering taxes —
corporate taxes — down to from 15 to 20 per cent and were getting rid of 75
per cent of the regulations — from 35 down to 15 to 20, we haven’t picked
the final but from 15 to 20, and we’re also gonna let the companies bring
back their money with the inversion, corporate inversion.
That will affect people like Google?
Well, we’ve got five — I think it’s five, they say it’s 2.5-3, I think
it’s five, but it’s $5 trillion over there and they can’t bring back
their money so that’s part of our tax bill, the money comes back.
Given your views on free trade, would you say that you’re a conservative?
I’m pragmatic, look I go in front of crowds — I had the biggest crowds
anybody’s ever had for a presidential election and that’s tough and when I
was fighting with Jeb Bush, ya know “low energy” Jeb, he would say, ‘
Donald Trump is not a conservative’, so I’d go in front of 25,000 people
and, like in Michigan, where there’s massive — 32,000 people — and I’m
screaming, ‘Jeb Bush says I’m not a conservative’, they’re screaming, ‘
Who cares?’, and I said, ‘What do you want? Do you want conservative or a
good deal?’ And the reason, because Jeb Bush said I’m not a conservative
because I don’t believe in free trade — well I do believe in free trade, I
love free trade, but it’s gotta be smart trade so I call it fair trade —
and the problem, so I said to the people, ‘Do you want a conservative or do
you want somebody who’s gonna make great deals?’, and they’re all
screaming, ‘Great deals, great deals’ — they don’t care, there are no
labels — ya know there’s some people, he is not — Jeb Bush would stand up
— ‘He is not a true conservative’ — who cares — I am a conservative,
but I’m really about making great deals for the people so they get jobs . .
. the people don’t care ya know when you’re talking — they don’t care,
they want good deals — ya know what? They want their jobs back.
Do you have any models — are there heroes that you steer by — people you
look up to from the past?
Well, I don’t like heroes, I don’t like the concept of heroes, the concept
of heroes is never great, but certainly you can respect certain people and
certainly there are certain people — but I’ve learnt a lot from my father
— my father was a builder in Brooklyn and Queens — he did houses and
housing and I learnt a lot about negotiation from my father — although I
also think negotiation is a natural trait, I don’t think you can, you
either have it or you don’t, you get better at it but basically, the people
that I know who are great negotiators or great salesmen or great
politicians, it’s very natural, very natural . . . I got a letter from
somebody, their congressman, they said what you’ve done is amazing because
you were never a politician and you beat all the politicians. He said they
added it up — when I was three months into the campaign, they added it up
— I had three months of experience and the 17 guys I was running against,
the Republicans, had 236 years – ya know when you add 20 years and 30 years
— so I was three months they were 236 years — so it’s sort of a funny
article but I believe it’s like hitting a baseball or being a good golfer
— natural ability, to me, is much more important to me than experience and
experience is a great thing — I think it’s a great thing — but I learnt a
lot from my father in terms of leadership.
Your policy platform of America First implies you’re happy to see the rest
of the world suffer. Do you?
I don’t want it to be a disruption — I love the world, I want the world to
be good but we can’t go — I mean look at what’s happening to our country
— we are $20 trillion — we don’t know what we’re doing — our military
is weak — we’re in wars that never end, we’re in Afghanistan now 17 years
, they told me this, really — 17 years, it’s the longest war we’ve ever
been in.
Given what’s been reported this week, what does that say about your
relations with the intelligence community?
Well, we have to have, ya have to have the right people and as you know
Pompeo — who’s really been received, did a good job yesterday, head of the
CIA — might I think we have some very great people going in — I think we
have some great people — ya know I have a lot of respect for the
intelligence but a lot of leaks, a lot of fake news coming out, a lot of
fake news.
It’s been reported that a British former diplomat was involved in this
whole thing — do you think that we, in Britain, need to look at our
intelligence services?
Well, that guy is somebody that you should look at, because whatever he made
up about me it was false — he was supposedly hired by the Republicans and
Democrats working together — even that I don’t believe because they don’t
work together, they work separately — and they don’t hire the same guy —
what they got together? See the whole thing is fake news because it said
the, whoever it was, intelligence, the so-called intelligence, said he’s an
operative of Republicans and Democrats — they don’t work together, they
don’t work together.
Who do you think, then, is behind it all?
I think probably could be intelligence or it could be, it could be, the
Democrats.
When I just heard it — I ripped up the mat . . . if I did that in a hotel
it’d be the biggest thing — they’d have me on the front page of The New
York Post, right? And the other thing, I can’t even, I don’t even want to
shake hands with people now I hear about this stuff — ugh.
It’s fake news, it was totally made up and I just got a letter from people
that went to Russia with me — did you see that letter — very rich people,
they went with me, they said you were with us, I was with them, I wasn’t
even here when they said such false stuff.
I left, I wasn’t even there . . . I was there for the Miss Universe contest
, got up, got my stuff and I left — I wasn’t even there — it’s all . . .
so if this guy is a British guy you got a lot of problems.
How is being president going to change how you operate?
Ya know this is a very, very big change — I led a very nice life and ya
know successful and good and nice and this is a lot different — but ya know
my attitude on that is when you’re president, you’re in the White House
which is a very special place — you’re there for a limited period of time
— who wants to leave? Like I’ve liked President Obama, he’s been very
nice, yeah he’s been nice one on one, but maybe not so nice in other ways
— but who wants to leave the White House to go to some other place and be
away on a vacation? The White House is very special, there’s so much work
to be done, I’m not gonna be leaving much — I mean a lot of work to be
done — I’m gonna be in there working, doing what I’m supposed to be doing
— but who wants to leave the White House?
They say Camp David is very nice.
Yea, Camp David is very rustic, it’s nice, you’d like it. You know how
long you’d like it? For about 30 minutes…
When you’re president will you still tweet? And if you do will it be as the
Real Donald Trump, as Potus, or probably as Real Potus?
@realDonaldTrump I think, I’ll keep it . . . so I’ve got 46 million people
right now — that’s a lot, that’s really a lot — but 46 million —
including Facebook, Twitter and ya know, Instagram so when you think that
your 46 million there, I’d rather just let that build up and just keep it @
realDonaldTrump, it’s working — and the tweeting, I thought I’d do less
of it, but I’m covered so dishonestly by the press — so dishonestly —
that I can put out Twitter — and it’s not 140, it’s now 140, 280 — I can
go bing bing bing and I just keep going and they put it on and as soon as I
tweet it out — this morning on television, Fox — “Donald Trump, we have
breaking news” — I put out a thing . . .
. . . You were tweeting a lot this morning?
I tweeted a little bit, yeah.
And you do it on your own?
I tweeted about the intelligence agencies because it all turned out to be
false information.
And you do it on that phone there?
This — I have numerous, I have numerous — I have iPhones, I have . . .
But nobody else knows how to log into your Twitter account?
No, I do — I have one or two people that do during the day I’ll just
dictate something and they’ll type it in.
So, Steve Bannon or someone else?
No, not Steve, but I have people that do it. But ya know the tweeting is
interesting because I find it very accurate — when I get a word out and if
I tell something to the papers and they don’t write it accurately, it’s
really bad — they can’t do much when you tweet it and I’m careful about,
it’s very precise, actually it’s very, very precise — and it comes out
breaking news, we have breaking news — ya know, it’s funny, if I did a
press release and if I put it out, it wouldn’t get nearly — people would
see it the following day — if I do a news conference, that’s a lot of work.
Although the media have been better lately, which is shocking, shocking —
in fact today they have a front-page story saying that Trump’s people will
never leave him — ya know all of the voters that I have will never leave —
which is very interesting cause we have great support in the country,
tremendous support, I was very surprised at that story.
What role will [your son-in-law] Jared [Kushner] play?
Oh, really . . . Ya know what, Jared is such a good kid and he’ll make a
deal with Israel that no one else can — ya know he’s a natural, he’s a
great deal, he’s a natural — ya know what I was talking about, natural —
he’s a natural deal-maker — everyone likes him.
And will [your daughter] Ivanka play a big role in the administration?
Well, not now, she’s going to Washington, and they’re buying a house or
something, but ya know she’s got the children, so Jared will be involved as
we announced — no salary, no nothing. If he made peace — who’d be better
at that then Jared, right — there’s something about him . . .
Are you looking forward to meeting our prime minister?
Well, I’ll be there — we’ll be there soon — I would say we’ll be here
for a little while but and it looks like she’ll be here first — how is she
doing over there, by the way, what do you think?
Theresa?
Yeah, May.
She’s got very strong approval ratings.
Popular. How are they doing with the break-up? How’s the break-up going?
Well, the PM wants to get a strong deal with the US.
Well, we’re gonna get a trade deal. Well, how is our Nigel doing? I like
him, I think he’s a great guy, I think he’s a very good guy and he was
very supportive. He’d go around the US — he was saying Trump’s gonna win.
He was one of the earliest people that said Trump was gonna win. So, he’s
gotta feel for it. Michael, you should’ve written that we were gonna win.
Well, at least let me give you a copy of my book on how to fight terrorism.
Good, I’d love that. That’s fantastic — how to fight terrorism, I can use
that. | n****g
发帖数: 14743 | 3 看原文吧。
这个中文的东西，是不是给中···共·国的Ｐ民的啊
”。
【在 D**s 的大作中提到】
: http://m.guancha.cn/DonaldTrump/2017_01_19_390251.shtml
: 【正当全球目光聚焦于中欧的达沃斯时，德国《图片报》与英国《泰晤士报》刊发了对
: 特朗普的联合专访，在特朗普就职前夕，提供了一个审视其思想的窗口。
: 特朗普在专访中狠批默克尔的移民政策，大赞英国“脱欧”，引发德国政界强烈反应，
: 副总理加布里尔呼吁德国人要“自信”。甚至法国总统奥朗德也反击说：“欧盟不需要
: 外界指点必须怎么做。”
: 在访谈中，特朗普还扬言，如果在美国销售的宝马汽车产自海外，就要加税。但他同时
: 又说，德国与中国的“情况不一样”，“大多数贸易逆差来自中国，中国是个大问题”。
: 特约译者宋武翻译《图片报》访谈全文，以飨读者。】
: 德国《图片报》主编凯·狄克曼（Kai Diekmann）在唐纳德·特朗普的纽约办公室里采
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