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p******a 发帖数: 975 | 5 想加入群的牌友,请站内PM我,并且注明自己的QQ号。如果是新ID请先回复这个帖子。 |
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W********m 发帖数: 7793 | 7 某大神曾经说过,"you should have a bluff range on every decision." preflop
cold 4 bet 也是, best hand to 4 bet is probably a hand with a blocker like
Axs or even total trash at the right spot.
Merge $100.00 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players -
MP1: $100.65
MP2: $248.67
CO: $282.33
BTN: $97.00
SB: $143.83
Hero (BB): $100.00
UTG: $96.34
UTG+1: $100.00
Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is BB with X X
5 folds, BTN raises to $3, SB raises to $8.25, Hero raises to $23, BTN
raises to $97, SB fold. HERO?
这里button vpip 16/11/5,... 阅读全帖 |
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p******a 发帖数: 975 | 8 周末早晨我一般起的比较早。有时候想玩6max没人就去打HU。ACR上一群bum hunter,
全部都是打个三四手,看我比较aggressive就不打了。今天NL50 有8桌HU,坐下去居然
没一个肯玩的。有个哥们儿只和我打过8手牌,然后我坐下去丫直接说:"Sorry, I don
't want to play with you."
一方面我觉得这是对我的赞扬,一方面觉得这些bum hunter太disgraceful了。其中有
几个我自己都觉得没什么edge,本着赢不了钱玩玩也是好的的心态,丫们都不肯玩。 |
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t********t 发帖数: 5415 | 10 另外说到Merson,他去年还拿了10k NL 6max的手链这个大家还都记得吧?能拿下这两
根手链基本能算NLH顶尖高手了 |
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y********n 发帖数: 2063 | 11 前提条件是,彼此之间信息全无
我的一点看法
1 以你所在的ps 25NL的整个player pool的信息为基础,做决定。比如大牛你前几万手
牌里,包括你involved或者是旁观的3bet pot的%,preflop是不是经常3bet 4bet,整
体的commit pot的hand strength,hand showdown的比例,整体的aggression程度(即
大多数时候,这个级别的game是soft或者是push hard)等等。哥觉得在相对soft的
game environment里,JJ在这里call 3bet oop,以pot control为基础play post flop
问题不大,换言之,marginal。而在非常pushy的game里,postflop会变得异常难打,
大多数情况下ended up猜对手有没有牌,大的variance不可避免。
----------Yes, you are right.
而在非常pushy的game里,postflop会变得异常难打,
大多数情况下ended up猜对手有没有牌,大的variance不可避免。
2 从game... 阅读全帖 |
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d*****0 发帖数: 1500 | 12 nl100 6max
面对未知loose passive的对手,hero形象正常,梢凶,effective stack 100bb。
btn limp
hero at sb open 4bb with KQo, villain bb call, btn call
flop K69 two suits, pot 12bb, hero 8bb cbet, villain call, btn fold
turn K added another flush draw, pot 28bb, hero 17bb 2nd barrel, villain
call
river 2, no flush, hero pot size shove
哥当时是想从weak K上最大化value,所以pot size第三barrel,但是仔细想想能value
到的hand其实未必比能beat哥牌的hand多,与其这样,还不如bet个1/3,把weak hand
全不勾进来,外加induce bluff
元芳,你怎么看 |
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d*****0 发帖数: 1500 | 13 my2c
usually the thinking level of 6max-25NL is still kind of low. Not many
players care about balancing. I even doubt how much % of players are aware
of it, which ended up playing ABC regardless your rival's style/level/table
dynamic and etc.
It does not mean most players in the pool are dumb tho. Actually the real
reason imo is the % of bad players is so high, which forces a good player to
adjust his play into a more straightforward/simple style.就像打live 1/2一样
,遭遇未知对手,你不是先假设他理解poker的常识,而是先把他当成初... 阅读全帖 |
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q****8 发帖数: 3281 | 14 Nice turn check!
but I don't think 64s is that bad.
In hu, I will never fold 64s in sb to 3bet.
In 6max, I will often play this hand as Btn vs sb or bb's 3bet, if the stack
is at least 100bb. Call or 4bet both fine, it depends.
I don't play full ring, but I think it is probably a fold.
I don't know man, maybe I like to gamble. |
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W********m 发帖数: 7793 | 15 友情提醒, 首先不要和FCF 这种神比. 我们都是凡人.
其次要分清win rate 和 sustainable win rate. 如果抽个3万手牌, 你总能发现有那
么几个可以整到10bb/100 hand, (对, 三万手其实真不多, 我在FTP BF 前 打了快一百
万手牌, 扑克的variance 比你想象得大, 下风对赢率影响很大). 其实长期在reg 多一
点的网站 (比如ACR, carbon) NL100+ 搞到5bb/100 hand SUSTAINABLE winrate 很不
容易,凤毛麟角.
最后, 偷窥一下自己的赢率,班主老实交代, live 和你想得差不多, online 其实打得
不少, 赢率 NL100 < 5bb, NL50 > 5bb. |
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q****8 发帖数: 3281 | 16 小POPO是属于在扑克上有着一颗雄心,不断挑战,不断进取的好青年。WINRATE对于风
暴和我这种中年猥琐男,没有什么意义。(我是看见风暴兄一帖子里这样自称,才在这
里加上你的,不要介意啊。。)
ONLINE WINRATE最简单的提升方式就两条:
1.找对网站,只在某些小网站打,里面平均水平低。
2.找对对手,不要和REG打,做BUM HUNTER,最多和比较差的REG打打。
我上半年打的比较多,10万手牌,NL600胜率13点几/100。8月以来打了2万手,基本持
平,胜率可能跌倒10BB/100以下。下半年为什么不赢,除了网站一些原因外,另一重要
因素是我经常和BIG WINNER打HU,或3人,输了TILT很厉害。所以说,要保持WINRATE,
就要做到上面两条;想要挑战,想要提高,就不要管WINRATE。
WINRATE和水平有必然联系吗?未必。我在MERGE WINRATE够高了吧?如果现在让我去
POKERSTAR打NL600,说实话,我不知道是赢是输。我自信可以BEAT NL200,但胜率不会
超过5BB/100。所以说,单看这些WINRATE数据没有意义。 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 17 我剛到Bovoda,前10K手 winrate >40bb/100,我一边打一边想,这尼吗的怎么可能,下
面肯定会有个大的downswing。 现在果然来了,才又3000手,就掉了一半到20bb/100了
。看看还要多久到正常范围。 |
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y********n 发帖数: 2063 | 18 1. FCF的帖子已经过时了。这个他自己也是承认的。
2。虽然现在查不到数据了, 但是通过online forum 还是能找出答案。在NL200级别,
win rate已经很难超过5bb/100.
3. 其实想想也挺正常,如果打zoom , rush之类的,大家手数都上去的超快,整体的进
步也是超快的。如果60%是大小reg在上面打,winrate肯定都高不了。
PS上级别最高的zoom就是2.5/5,基本上没有fish。尽管没有具体的数据,但我相信只
要在那个级别的winrate达到2bb/100, 一年20万美刀还是比较轻松的。
4. win rate 在手数比较少时,相差会很大(个人认为20万手都不说明问题)。Qing78
,storm—mm已经谈了很多,还有一点是:winrate和时代紧密相关,你今年10bb/100,
不代表你明年还是这样,即便你水平没有下降,甚至有所提高。 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 19 那就是说大家赢钱主要靠rakeback?
Qing78 |
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q****8 发帖数: 3281 | 20 Merge,bovada, pokerstars都没有rakeback。 |
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R******p 发帖数: 35 | 21 On Bovada, you can convert poker points into tourney tickets. But the
effective rakeback % is very low, using the cash value of the tickets and
assuming you have fair share of equity in the tourney. The tourneys are
pretty juicy though.
PS has more options and the % is not too bad. The higher the vip level, the
better.
Don't know about merge. |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 22 我说的rakeback包括VIP之类的。any money u receive from house, not win from
villains directly |
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q****8 发帖数: 3281 | 23 就merge来讲,那些只是九牛一毛,基本对盈利与否不起作用,外加现在政策越来越差。ps
的vip program应该是最好的。 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 24 我在merge的rake大概12bb/100,15%的VIP不就差不多2bb么?
PS就更不用说了
ps |
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y********n 发帖数: 2063 | 25 your overall winning is equal to the winrate multiply by how many hands you
have
played.
Apparently all of us overlook the second factor of this equation.
rakeback is an extra bouns. PS's SNE gives you around 100K for the first
year, 130K for the second year. But it is very hard to achieve.-------〉注意
这部分收入是不受波动影响的
你可以把rackback看成是推销员的佣金。所以9人桌的佣金肯定要大于6人卓的佣金,因
为你在9人桌上拉了其他8位客户。。
同时你得到你佣金和你拉到的全部生意有关。拉得越多,rakeback越多。
估计楼主对所提到的dusty schmidt看法有偏差,而且并不知道对手总共打了多少手牌。
dusty schmidt等于是翻版的nanonoko。他是那种20---... 阅读全帖 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 26 搞了半天,rakeback这个extra bonus比职业的winrate都高,这还是很让人泄气的。 |
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y********n 发帖数: 2063 | 27 我要申明一点:打牌的手数是决定性的因数之一。
比如你得winrate是100BB/100,但是你一个月就打1000手牌,你也只能赢10买入。
你的rakeback也可以忽略不计。
相反的情况需要建立在你的能力(打牌的数量)之上,我在这里举例就没有必要了。 |
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W********m 发帖数: 7793 | 28 rake 也是你赢的钱。 rakeback 的收入不丢脸。 其实rake 如果太高, 最后只有谁
都赢不了钱, 你再牛X也没有用。
★ 发自iPhone App: ChineseWeb 7.8 |
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y********n 发帖数: 2063 | 29 这个帖子本身也会绕回到windstormm以前提到的一个观点。就是小时盈率(或月盈利)
的问题,我个人觉得小时盈率在有一定的winrate的基础上,比单纯得提winrate有意义
多了。-----〉因为不但考虑winrate,还考虑multi-table的因素。
当然qing78等于变相的反驳了windstorm以前提的赢钱越多,poker水平越高的论点。
nanonoko可能赢得钱比isldur更多,但不代表他的poker水平更好。
水600以上(1天),那你得每次投入多少本金(风险大),要赢多少(回报没有那么大
,被抽走600利润)才能才能作为赢家阿。 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 30 我明白你的意思,手数当然很重要,开两桌和二十桌差别太大了。
我只是比较一下win rate and rakeback,单位都是bb/100一样的。这么说来努力提高
win rate 还不如去找个rakeback的见效 |
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y********n 发帖数: 2063 | 31 对于thread而言,我们都给出了有用的回复。
1。windstron, sustainable winrate is more important.
2. qing78, winrate 变化实在太大。
3。me, winrate和时代相关,目前这个阶段,5bb/100已经足够好,剩下的就是多打,
build banroll,然后升级打更高级别。
4。me, 没有足够手数,什么winrate, rakeback都是扯淡。 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 32 6max 100nl,
Maniac at BB with Kh3d
Preflop
Fold to SB, SB limp,
What would you do?
A maniac of coz bets $3. SB villain calls.
Flop Jh7c2d
What would you do?
A maniac of coz bets on a dry board like this, so here goes $4 c-bet.
Something interesting happens. SB raise to $9.
What would you do?
There is nothing wrong to fold here. Since we are talking about maniac, of
coz reraise to $20.
SB call.
Turn 5d,
SB check, maniac bets $25, SB calls.
River 9s,
SB check, maniac bets $53 all in, SB fold.
L... 阅读全帖 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 33 顶.
traffic怎么样,6max 100NL有人玩么,可以用HUD么? |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 34 顶.
traffic怎么样,6max 100NL有人玩么,可以用HUD么? |
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d*****0 发帖数: 1500 | 35
说真的 加入我们的6max qq群 我很想旁观一下大哥的game |
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p******a 发帖数: 975 | 36 要注意的是这个网站的BB其实是bb,就是一个big blind。standard deviation的话一
般6max是100bb/100。但是这个也和打法有关,从你的描述看可能你的standard
deviation会更大一点。
你的例子确实比较极端,所以我建议你贴到大一点的论坛去问问。
还有一个问题是,我们能不能假设EV线就代表了真实的win rate。这个可能也是一个比
较大的假设,因为run的好的时候的EV线和run的不好的时候的EV线也会差很多。
谱. |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 37 你们在哪儿玩呢? 我还没怎么玩过HU,但我知道自己不行. 我以前玩过一阵S&G,发现我
最有可能得的是第二名. 有时候6max只剩下两个人了我感觉也玩得不好. 记得有一次剩
下个fish,我和他来来回回玩了好半天,终于把他赢光了,还挺高兴的,结果仔细一看还亏
了一点点,都交了rake了. |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 39 AJ这种牌好象挺大的,但又不够大,怎么玩都觉得不顺. 问问大家都是怎么处理的.
For example, bovada 200NL 6Max
Hero has AJo at BB, MP preflop raise to 3bb, BTN call, 这时候你们一般怎么办
的?
如果Call吧,以后都是out of position. Fold又不甘心. 如果squeeze, 被call了或者
reraise light也很难办. 你们一般都是怎么处理的? |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 40 刚玩的一手有点意思的牌
Bovada 200nl 6max,
Villain BB ? He seems loose sticky and aggressive.
Hero SB As4d
Preflop
Everybody else folded. Hero raise to $7, Villian call.
Flop 7s6s3h
Hero check, Villian bets $10, Hero calls.
Turn 3d
Hero check, Villian bets 15, Hero calls.
River Kd
Hero check, Villian bets 21, Hero raise to 45, Villian tanks and folds. |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 41 Bovada 200NL 6Max
Villain: CO ? He is an aggressive short stacker with ~ $120
Hero: SB, 8d8h
Preflop
Villain open with $6, Hero calls, everybody else fold.
Flop As7s3s
Hero check, Villain bet $8, Hero calls.
Turn Js
Hero check, Villain bet $16, Hero calls.
River 9s
Hero check, Villain bet $26, Hero all in, Villain tank and fold. |
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p******a 发帖数: 975 | 42 你VPIP这么高还能有这么高的EV真是厉害。你这是拿出打HU的力气在打6max啊 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 43 又去那个养鱼塘试了一下200NL 6max. 软件太不好用,只开了两桌,一开始运气挺好的,
两次all in, combo draw vs over pair on flop, AK vs JJ blind vs blind preflop
, 都赢了. 结果高兴劲还没过,几分钟内两桌各一把牌就把我wipe out了. 看来点背还
是要怪自己,和在哪儿玩没关系.
Hand One.
short hand table, only 3 players including me. 在我的带动下气氛非常活跃,基本
上preflop都要3bet,互相raise and reraise with air.
SB ~250
BB ~$600
Hero, BTN, ~$550
Preflop,
Hero with A6s, open $7, SB and BB both call
Flop, A62r
Hero bets $19, SB check calls $19, BB check raise to $90, Hero calls, SB
fold
Considering the table ... 阅读全帖 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 44 刚才中午回家吃饭的时候顺便玩了一小会,贴一手比较有意思的bluff成功的例子.
200NL 6max
BB: ~$400, a good aggressive player who is aware that I am very loose. I
have seen him 3bet or squeeze a few times. Not crazily often. But often
enough that I believe he must have bluffed some of them.
MP: $200, a player new to the table
BTN: Hero, ~$500 with JsTc
Preflop
MP open to $5
Hero call $5
BB raise to $20
MP fold
Hero call $20
Flop: As3d4d
BB cbet $25
Hero call $25
Turn: 6d
BB bet $72
Hero call $72
River: 9c
BB check
Hero bet $170
BB t... 阅读全帖 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 45 200NL 6Max
CO: $200 ? an aggressive and sticky player that steals often
SB: Hero > $300 5c5s
Preflop
CO opens to $8,
Hero calls from SB
Everybody else fold
Flop
As7h8h
Hero check
CO cbets $10
Hero call
Turn Td
Hero check
CO bets 28.5
Hero raise to 73
CO tank and call
River 4d
Hero bets all in
CO snap fold |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 46 200NL 6max
BTN: ~ $200 calling station
BB: Hero ~$200 AhQs
Preflop
BTN opens to $6
Hero 3bet to $19
BTN calls
Flop 7h3s2d
Hero cbet $22.5
BTN calls
So, the calling station most likely has a medium pocket pair.
Turn 6s
Hero decided not to bluff a calling station further.
Hero check
BTN check
River Kc
Hero was going to give up, but the river K looks so attractive. Hero changed
the mind, and bet $65
BTN think think think and call with 99 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 47 什么时候能有4桌200NL 6max的时候,记得叫下我. |
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w***w 发帖数: 6301 | 48 连一台6max也没有。
只有10-max。
每晚的$100tournament,只有20个人,其中10个还是死人。
所以淘汰5人就能拿钱。 |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 49 6max 200NL
BB: ~$100 aggressive
SB: Hero $200 9h9d
Preflop
Everybody folds
Hero opens to $10
BB calls
Flop
JcTc3h
Hero cbet $10
BB raise to $20
Hero shove
BB think think think and fold |
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s*****s 发帖数: 1130 | 50 6max 200NL, with only 3 players
BB: ~ $500, a good thinking player. I have been stealing and 3bet him almost
every single time and he has been trying to fight back.
BTN: Hero ~ $500 with 9s8c
Preflop,
Hero opens $5,
SB folds,
BB 3bet to $17
Hero calls
Flop: Js6h2d
BB cbet $20
Hero calls
Turn: Qc
BB second barrel $42.5
Hero calls
River: Kh
BB third barrel: $75
Hero raise to $175
BB tank and fold and left. |
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