n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 1 I think if Dodgers win game 3, it will be Maddux. He has pitched against Phi
llies (almost) his entire career and the giant Dodger stadium will benefit h
im.
If Dodgers lose game 3, maybe they will run Lowe out. Pitching on short rest
may do good for his sinker though. |
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B****s
发帖数: 796 | 2 勇士运气差了点，输的四场包括Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz。第4场养鸡的烂投手Kenny
Rogers 0：6落后，都又追平然后赢了，第5场Petitte投到9局，1；0赢了Smotz。亚特
兰大的牛棚差点，closer心理素质差。 |
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c********x
发帖数: 232 | 3 Pedro Martinez will make a start tomorrow for the Phillies. To me, Pedro is
not only a first ballot HOFer, he's also one of the greatest pitchers ever
lived. I'd poll everyone to see who you think is the best pitcher ever, and
the best you ever see.
This is the list:
Sandy Koufax
Warren Spahn
Lefty Grover
Steve Carlton
Cy Young
Tom Seaver
Nolan Ryan
Walter Johnson
Roger Clemens
Randy Johnson
Greg Maddux
Pedro Martinez
Or others (please name).
I have never watched the first 8 pitchers pitch, of c |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 4 The most dominant pitcher of the steroids era just retired. He may
not be better than Maddux, but Randy Johnson is just dominant.
I do not think the ban of performance enhancers necessarily benefit
the pitchers. Don't forget Roger Clemens did it, at least as we
know of.
Among the active pitchers, Pettitte and Halladay probably have the
best shot. I really hope doc can get there. |
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h*****p
发帖数: 2638 | 5 hehe, 本来估计maddux想破记录的，把自己小孩就做
Paige - son,
Satchel - daughter |
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l***y
发帖数: 127 | 6 debatable, but pretty close.
93 braves
Maddux Glavine Smoltz Avery |
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j*****n
发帖数: 3617 | 7 你好像多数了一天啊，星期六33，星期日32，今天才31
#31, Greg Maddux, arguably the best pitcher in the 90s. |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 8 nod nod. Maddux has a great 2 seamer which comes back to plate.
Speed probably only at low-mid 80s. |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 9 I think both Doc and Lee this year are better than Schilling in D'Back's
WS year. But Unit was just too good to be true. He had to be the most
dominant pitcher in the last thirty years, maybe even longer. To me,
Glavine and Pedro are not at his level. Maddux and Rocket are a few
points below. |
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A**d
发帖数: 13310 | 10 Idiots like you don't have common sense. Most MLB hitters love fastballs
because it's the easiest to catch up with.
Unit 4135.1IP 411HR
Maddux 5008.1IP 353HR
Glavine 4413.1IP 356HR |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 11 Bonds and Clemens are never confirmed of doping either.
That entire period was dark. We have reason to question every slugger and
every pitcher. I do not care if it is Unit or Maddux or Biggio. They need to
be treated the same despite the fact that some of them might not be doping. |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 12 first ballot is a huge honor.
craig biggio is not there. Frank Thomas is far away. A couple of players
next year have chances. Greg Maddux is a shoot-in. I think Tom Glavine will
make it the first year as well. When Unit becomes eligible, he will be.
For the hitters, OK, I do not care how clean they look. They all carry an
asterick, including KGJ and Jim Thome. |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 13 看同谁比啊。Maddux最后的快球也就85。照样K掉无数人。:) |
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z******n
发帖数: 1223 | 14 McGwire作为当代球员的15年有效期已经过去七年了
Ortiz的有效期在退役五年后才开始
Ortiz再打三年的话McGwire只要能作为当代球员入选就肯定是在Ortiz的资格开始之前
问题是McGwire这七年里从来没有超过25%得票，而入选需要75%
128 of the 545 cast (23.5% of the vote) in 2007,
128 of 543 (23.6%) in 2008,
118 of 539 (21.9%) in 2009,
128 of 539 (23.7%) in 2010,
115 of 581 (19.8%) in 2011,
112 of 573 (19.5%) in 2012,
96 of 569 (16.9%) in 2013.
投票者的情绪是显而易见的。
去年Biggio（68.2%）、Morris（67.7%）、Bagwell（59.6%）、Piazza（57.8%）、Tim
Raines（52.2%）得票都是McGwire的三倍以上，这些人都得分在以后几年入选
Schilling第一年也拿到38.8%
更不利的是今后几年有很多强... 阅读全帖 |
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z******n
发帖数: 1223 | 15 McGwire作为当代球员的15年有效期已经过去七年了
Ortiz的有效期在退役五年后才开始
Ortiz再打三年的话McGwire只要能作为当代球员入选就肯定是在Ortiz的资格开始之前
问题是McGwire这七年里从来没有超过25%得票，而入选需要75%
128 of the 545 cast (23.5% of the vote) in 2007,
128 of 543 (23.6%) in 2008,
118 of 539 (21.9%) in 2009,
128 of 539 (23.7%) in 2010,
115 of 581 (19.8%) in 2011,
112 of 573 (19.5%) in 2012,
96 of 569 (16.9%) in 2013.
投票者的情绪是显而易见的。
去年Biggio（68.2%）、Morris（67.7%）、Bagwell（59.6%）、Piazza（57.8%）、Tim
Raines（52.2%）得票都是McGwire的三倍以上，这些人都得分在以后几年入选
Schilling第一年也拿到38.8%
更不利的是今后几年有很多强... 阅读全帖 |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 16 One thing is pretty certain. Tanaka has control, which can be translated to
MLB. Pitchers do not have to overpower. Maddux can testify that. :)
I think he will be at least a No. 2 for a playoff contender, which makes him
probably worth 6/100 or 7/110. |
|
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 18 Frank Thomas was a long time White Sox. He was a two time MVP, and got 500
HR under his belt.
This is how he looks like when he was a rookie.
This is how he looks like in 2005 |
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t*a
发帖数: 18880 | 19 还是不大认识，觉得前2个有名许多，赫赫，可能所在球队的缘故? 记得葛拉文在90年
代的中华职棒二代游戏中就有... 最强力的外援投手... |
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a********l
发帖数: 39524 | 20 does this open the door to other players potentially linked to PED? |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 21 For those who are linked, I'd say no. But for guys like Griffey Jr, they are
in.
This is a shame that Thomas got in before Bonds, not to mention that he got
the honor of first ballot HOFer. |
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a***n
发帖数: 5665 | 22 就算bonds 2000之后数据全不算，也应该比big hurt强吧？
I |
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i*********r
发帖数: 5101 | 25 maybe those voters (mostly reporters) have some insider information?
like
power
remember |
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z******n
发帖数: 1223 | 26 The Houston Astros are still waiting for the first Hall of Famer inducted
wearing their cap... |
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n*****n
发帖数: 1361 | 27 So I guess Frank Thomas paved the way for Ortiz to get in, as DH? |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 28 Ortiz tested positive once, I think. |
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z******n
发帖数: 1223 | 29 A lot may happen in 20-25 years;
Yet the way is still stormy for Ortiz judging from today. He may have 2-3
years left to play, then have to wait 5 years, then may have to spend a lot
of years lingering around 30% of the ballot. |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 30 I do not care whether he gets in or not. In fact, I think he should. I also
think Bonds, Clemens, Rose, Palmero... all should get in. Just do not use
double standards.
lot |
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l*****d
发帖数: 1948 | 31 right. do not use double standard. use asterisk.
also |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 34 hypocritic. :)
it sounds like he did not know mcguire and conseco used steroids. it sounds
like his 2000+ wins had nothing to do with roid users in his club house.
of course steroid users should be in. they are the best of their generation,
which should the only criterion for HOF selection. |
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s****n
发帖数: 4266 | 35 今日前白袜，运动家，蓝鸟球员Frank Thomas,前勇士和大都会投手Tom Glavine，效力
过勇士，小熊，道奇，教士的Greg Maddux正式成为棒球名人堂的最新成员。另外前洋
基，道奇教练Joe Torre，前运动家，红雀教练Tony La Russa，前勇士教练Bobby Cox
也以教练身份成为棒球名人堂的成员。 |
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n*******e
发帖数: 2213 | 36 to make one more point about it,
Pedro, Unit, Maddux are clearly the best among the bunch. Way better than
everyone else. The same thing can be said about Roger Clemens but his
candidacy is tainted by PED.
Now, it comes to this quesiton, 3 other pitchers, Smoltz, Mussina, Schilling
, who's better? One can argue that Smoltz is the best because he has a Cy
Young and he's got all those saves. Schilling had a few really dominant
years with both Dbacks and RedSox and has a better career ERA+ than Smo... 阅读全帖 |
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h*****s
发帖数: 155 | 37
KC 皇家队的诀窍是先发投手一般只投6局，因为再投下去，打击手在第三次面对同一个
投手时，打击率会高很多。所以他们不需要巨星，一个队，有几个巨星，把工资占了很
高的比例，就没钱请好的救援投手和打击手，这对季后赛是非常不利的。KC皇家的总经
理和经理，都是原来亚特兰大勇士队出来的，对勇士队的三个巨投，Greg Maddux, To
ｍ Ｇｌａｖｉｎｅ， ＪｏｈｎＳｍｏｌｔｚ，非常了解。可是这三个人，十几年，
只拿到一个世界总冠军。作为勇士队的球迷，真是无奈啊。
还有个例子是费城队，那时候，四个大牌，多牛。后来也是烟消云散。就一个总冠军。
当然，有比没强。用个现代的词，就是不可持续性发展。现在的LA道奇队又是一个现成
的例子。 |
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H**p
发帖数: 2504 | 38 你们要感谢我大乌鸦04年第二场就把Maddux撞伤了，大本才能顺利接班，那年你们就输
了我们一场，15-1，大本首发后就没输过，直到AFCC被拍子做掉。不过大本运气好，下
一年就拿碗了。
, |
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p******s
发帖数: 5200 | 39 maddux + glavine
数据很好，名人堂里喝头汤
戒指只有一个 |
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s*****h
发帖数: 44903 | 40
Recent Meetings
Date Home / Away M/L O/U Home Starter IP Away Starter
IP
08/24/15 CHC 2 - CLE 1 CHC -130 U 7.5 J. Lester 8.2 C.
Kluber 7.2
06/18/15 CLE 4 - CHC 3 CLE -144 U 7.5 D. Salazar 4.2 J.
Hammel 4.0
06/17/15 CLE 0 - CHC 17 CHC 115 O 8.5 S. Marcum 2.0 T.
Wada 7.0
06/16/15 CHC 0 - CLE 6 CLE 130 U 6.5 J. Arrieta 5.0 T.
Bauer 7.0
06/21/09 CHC 6 - CLE 2 CHC -159 U 9.0 R. W... 阅读全帖 |
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B*****e
发帖数: 9375 | 41
RJ是谁？
过去二十多年的前一半我看了棒球 后一半没看
但是要说”近2，30年的最佳投手”
得包括Greg Maddux吧
他投的球 真的是很好看不暴力那种
(“太难看太暴力”就是很多人不喜欢LBJ的原因？)
他的355胜
应该能保持”Winnest Pitcher Alive"的头衔很多年了吧
不过也是只有一枚戒指 |
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s****z
发帖数: 1665 | 42 还有俩马甲，Glavine和Maddux。。。。不过很久没用可能失效了。。。。 |
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D*******e
发帖数: 12862 | 43 <3>
上一章写过了本世纪初洋基红袜响尾蛇交相辉映的那个时代，现在终于开始轮到写我最
熟悉的这批当代牛投们了。。。SI曾评选过一个MLB在00-09年间的all-decade team，
结果深与我心有戚戚焉--五位rotation投手就是我上一章写过的那三位大牛Pedro，
Johnson，Schilling，再加上新生代的两位翘楚Halladay & Santana。的确，如果要写
这个世纪以来最好的投手们，我心里大概有一个六七个人的名单，其中Doc本来就是排
在第一位的，他是我心目中这个时代的顶尖投手的代表，是ace of the aces，而现在
他的去世更坚定了我要用专门的一章来dedicate给他的想法，就像其他爱他的人用
youtube上的tribute videos来纪念他一样，希望能够向这位在我熟悉棒球的年代最稳
定最有统治力最优秀的投手致以一份深深的景仰和敬意(当然，还有无尽的惋惜与伤痛)。
很多时候不得不感慨人生中有无数的curve balls--假如邓... 阅读全帖 |
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D*******e
发帖数: 12862 | 44 好，现在有空了，来贴一下这些人的数据 ：)
先科普一下背景知识--预测cooperstown入选几率的主要评分标准是career war/peak
war/jaws score
peak war又称war 7,是选职业生涯最高的7年(可以不连续)，那我就不明白了，为什么
war 7比career war的数值要低呢，不是应该更高才对么。。。
而jaws score是这俩当然平均或者加权平均，我也没有100%搞清楚 //汗
进入cooperstown需要>75%的votes,so far全部votes大概已经进来了接近60%。。。
先来看看模范排头兵chipper jones同学:
他的数据是85/47/66，而HOFers在他这个位置上的平均值是66/43/54，所以他是一点儿
疑问都没有的lock down的first ballot HOFer。。。预计他的票选比例最终会超过95%
甚至97%，甚至有可能会是historic的，以前也有过几个灰常高的，maddux,big unit,
Jr，还有人说未来jeter甚至有可能接近100%。。。
然后是类似位置的jim thome,73/... 阅读全帖 |
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D*******e
发帖数: 12862 | 45 特别对！
你以前为什么不提醒我这点？
我最近终于realize到以前的画地为牢是多么的没有必要，所以我才会去写那篇关于棒
球的系列。。。
最近刚看完了一本关于maddux的书。。。真的发现，每个牛人都有自己独特牛的地方，
也都有各自不同的性格和经历，因为饭A就仇视B真的是完全没有必要的呀 |
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b**l
发帖数: 33123 | 46 ☆─────────────────────────────────────☆
Dominique (曾经木木难为水 除却金色不是云) 于 (Tue Jan 9 03:13:56 2018, 美东) 提到:
<3>
上一章写过了本世纪初洋基红袜响尾蛇交相辉映的那个时代，现在终于开始轮到写我最
熟悉的这批当代牛投们了。。。SI曾评选过一个MLB在00-09年间的all-decade team，
结果深与我心有戚戚焉--五位rotation投手就是我上一章写过的那三位大牛Pedro，
Johnson，Schilling，再加上新生代的两位翘楚Halladay & Santana。的确，如果要写
这个世纪以来最好的投手们，我心里大概有一个六七个人的名单，其中Doc本来就是排
在第一位的，他是我心目中这个时代的顶尖投手的代表，是ace of the aces，而现在
他的去世更坚定了我要用专门的一章来dedicate给他的想法，就像其他爱他的人用
youtube上的tri... 阅读全帖 |
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D***e
发帖数: 48486 | 47 以前勇士的者名Acer Mad Dog （Greg Maddux）做过，毕竟身背巨大的合同，球队MS仔
细评估了一下，还是批准作了
Drake |
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