r******h
发帖数: 99 | 1 I only felt good for a very short while. Two hands later, I lost most of my
chips.
Preflop:
MP miniraised to 40, BTN called 40, BB (me QcTs) called. I called because
MP has miniraised couple times and BTN is a (65/35) fish.
Flop: 4h9s9c Pot130
I don't think the board helped anyone. So I decided to pull out a tricky
play to steal the pot. Unfortunately it got too tricky and killed myself.
Let me try to explain what I did and what I was thinking.
First, I miniraised to see what happens. If... 阅读全帖 |
|
w***w
发帖数: 6301 | 2 通常bluff是用大钱赢小钱，就是说，bluff的成功率要达到70%以上才合算。
但是你这个thin value fold完全改变了bluff的风险和收益比率。以lz这个例子，对付
fold to miniraise的对手，我用miniraise bluff只要5次成功一次就合算。所以我碰
到你，我就会频繁用miniraise来bluff你，换句话说，由于你thin value fold降低了
别人对你bluff的代价，你会成为别人bluff的target。这就是你的leak。如果我和你同
台，发现你会fold to miniraise，我肯定会试图去exploit你这个leak。而且我不会对
别人用这招，只会对你用。 |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 3 又放不下自己trips的 就是送钱来的...
2$ utg raise 2$ half pot flop, 3$ 1/3 pot turn.. but miniraise for thin value river river.. end up
losing the whole stack. 他一miniraise river 我就知道他是AK, 他却想着miniraise to induce..... i never reinduce.. shoooooveeee.....
lesson learned.. if you slow play your hand you have to be able to fold when you are beat. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 4 I used "most" and "every time" unconciously. But this somehow proved my
point exactly. This is always a bad move, but sometimes, you mistake can
make you $$. I am not contradicting myself at all, am I?
The biggest problem with minibet and miniraise is that you can not balance
this move unless you miniraise with that board with set too. Is miniraising
with a set a good move here? I would rather semi-bluff and raise with 2 pair
sets larger at this spot with a balanced range. Or call with some of ... 阅读全帖 |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 5 fish 阿..after miniraise flop he just cant check turn. what does he expect
you to do? POT turn? He pretty much killed action with miniraise and still passive and hope you bet. either call flop raise big turn or raise flop and lead
bets 2/3pot turn at least... river is ok.
blinds |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 6 why scared of Js? your flat miniraise is one way to say that you are pretty
weak. would you at least miniraise back with set of J? or big raise back like 3X
set |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 7 nothing is abosolute in poker obviously. when you 5 bet all in with QQ vs
someone opens 20% preflop, fold to 3 bet 10%, 4 bet 10%, you can still run
into KK or AA.
So yeah, you can point out situations where you got pushed all in when you
miniraise with a set on a wet board. My question is whether you do this
often -- miniraising with set on wet board? If you do, i think you really
need to look at the long term impact other than 1 or 2 times where you get
paid off. If you don't do this often on... 阅读全帖 |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 8 miniraise or check miniraise? Either way FK the fish and 3 bet...
however, this fish's 3 bet % has an effect here. If his 3 bet is 2% or less.
I would probably just call and reevaluate turn. |
|
l**********t
发帖数: 269 | 9 fold fold fold. It is nl10. It was one of my major leaks. tptk is
rarely good enough here.
call/miniraise + huge river bet/all in === monster all the time. |
|
l***q
发帖数: 62 | 10 C raise75不到上一个raise数目100，不是legit raise。如果此时没有D的all-in，A和
B均只能call，因为正如frying所说，他们都已经act过了。
但是此前还没有机会反应的D选择allin，我认为等于re-open了action。新的miniraise
是75.故此，B可在350基础上再加75，就是425 straight （包括他第一次押的200）
D的raise数也太寸了点，正好跟C的raise相等。。。如果Draise数小于75，则B只能
call，如大于75，则以D的raise为最新的mini-raise |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 11 Played some more rush poker over the weekend. Down a little over all. I have
a feeling that I just can't consistently win at micro level cash yet. I am
going to put up a few hand for discussion.
Two hands here involved with bluffing or not bluffing river in position.
Hand 1:
NL 25. I have AK CO.
MP raise to 1$, I call. Everyone else fold
Flop Q 2 5 rainbow,
MP lead half pot 1.25$, I could fold here but i sense weakness, so I
miniraised since i still got outs. MP call. I know i must be behin |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 12 which is better in the following with the above case?
1) call flop half pot bets, miniraise to another half pot bets as played
2) call flop half pot bets, folds to another half pot bets. ( if he checks
then we bets 1/2-2/3 pot)
3) raise flop, if reraises then we fold, if he calls and check turn then we
fire half pot, if he bets another half pot then we fold.
I like case 3 better, seems we are investing less to achieve the same goal.
and we can get away easier if he bets out of position on turn. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 13 you don't want to scar him away by 4 bets big or shove, then at least
miniraise to 22$ and make him fell like you are restealling from button. At
least you put enough $$ in with your pocket As preflop and also can induce a
over shove from him maybe . |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 14 Rush NL 10
EP raise 3X i have JdJh at MP. I call
flop 7cQsJs
EP pot 7X
I miniraise to 14X. EP call pot 37X bb
turn 4s.
EP bet 28X
I call POT 89X
We both have 58X bb left.
river is a 9 of d
He push all in. What does he have?
small hint:
Some of the agrodonk probably moved down from NL 100 to NL 10 after getting
broke. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 15 if he check miniraise turn and push all in river. I will fold this hand
with set too. but i probably won't bet turn and just call river. if he check turn and all in river. I will have to fold as well. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 16 the difference is TPTK and over pair really does not beat much on river all
in other than bluff. but set beat plenty of 2 pair and lower set hand. The way he plays. It
is really hard for me to believe that he has got flush. I worry about AKs
and QQ. both hand I think he should have reraised when I raise. Any other
hand just don't add up to pot flop and call miniraise |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 17 if you always think people are slow playing your middle set with top set..
这牌没法打了.. got set of 5.. miniraised flop and someone flat.. pot turn...
if he has got top set.. he will let you know... he he call turn and river is a blank.. all in river.. simple
got
have more than half of your stack in.. then slow play it to the core.. milk
his last bit of stack |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 18 it call preflop button. miniraise flop 2.5X, check turn and fold river.. lol |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 19 I had a history with this guy. He probably does not remember me but last
time, he bet flop smallish with set, bet and call raise 2X pot size turn on
a flush board with sets and check quad river and i checked behind with my
flush.
This time. miniraise me pre-flop 3X to 5X. check after flop behind. call my
pot turn and re-raise my pot all in river. What do you think he has? In my
head, it was screaming AAAAAAAAA.... |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 20 I like call here. Unless he is really really bad, he won't call your shove
all in without a flush. Miniraise 2.5 X seems better where a lot of worse hand than a flush would call like 2 pair and set or even a busted flush draw but a top pair. But what is your plan if he comes over the top all in? Can you find a fold button? Wait.. no button here. Can you fold? |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 21 call is fine. I don't dislike call here. You can miniraise if you can find a
fold if he goes all in. The question is how would he play differently if
he flopped a top set? I would not have slowed down if I don't get a raise on turn. The bet size is pretty big but people over bet sets all the time especially there is no 4th suited card come on river.
? |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 22 So we can all be rich.
after he half pot flop and 2/3 pot turn and raise all in so hard vs my
miniraise.. i almost folded my set thinking for sure that he has got 10s..
lol... crying call for the win ( i had to time bank this for the call).. he sure played his pocket Qs like the nuts
after flop.. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 23 this hand does not matter what they have anymore.. you have the nuts and
someone miniraise and reraise all in.. lol
Jackpot! we are all so jealous..
guy
play |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 24 he does not need to call the miniraise flop... |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 25 3 is true because sometimes they have totally air which can not stand a
miniraise on any street. If you have top pair, it is better to keep them in
and let them do the heavy lifting.. ^_^ |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 26 you should still do it regardless.. lol..or just miniraise and he will fold to you. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 27 if you fold to miniraise 11X from 7X, why do you 3 bet at all? flat preflop |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 28 sometimes the only difference between aggression and spewing the pot is
whether you hit the flop.
I wouldn't show weakness vs an aggressive player while holding a marginal
hand. That's what you are doing preflop. your miniraise is looking for action from an agrodonk. Imaging the time when you don't
hit your dream flop, it would be hard to continue without spewing your whole
stack. if you are planning to go all in after flop with K high, it is not profitable. if you want to 3 bet and 4 bet stea |
|
a*****h
发帖数: 2182 | 29 我打得和你一样大。感觉和你相反，比bonus周前难打。
我这几天冤家牌pot都有1000多bb了，最烦的是一手有效stack 250bb的牌，cuteoff ra
ise 3bb, i rr 11bb with qq on button, big blind short stack cold call with K
K, cuteoff call
flop 559, check to me, i bet 2/3 pot put big blind allin and he did, cuteoff
call
turn came my diaster Q, I bet 1/3 pot, cuteoff miniraise, I put him on 99 or
AA, I raise again, he mini, then I allin, he instantly called and show 55
另外什么小set输给大set还有好几把，anyway,今天晚上有输了，打了一周，加上bonus
还输了 |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 30 刚才一把奇怪的牌
i raise prelfop he lead after flop 3X pot and i miniraise and he goes all in
with over pair of 10s on the flop.. and he draw out on turn. I almost
feel that he is a super user who can see what cards is coming out next... |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 31 来自主题: TexasHoldem版 - NL100 偷了一个小锅from short stack. he can't be folding any pair can he?
probably just AK.
Preflop i raise 3X he miniraise to 6X from sb. i call
flop he check i check.
turn he check again and I bet 3/4th pot.
river he check again. I put him all in for the rest of his 24$. he fold.. 不
偷天理不容啊.. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 32 有些bluff也太明现了.. miniraise preflop. check 2 street. and all of sudden
raise river? 我call得比拿着pocket 6s 还快...
short stack 多fish啊... |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 33 EP raise 3.5$ short stack fish.
LP miniraise to 6.5$, very little hand history. 67 hand vpip 20 17 0% 3 bet
i have QQ at sb..
fish is short stack 50$ me and lp both have 130 $
what do I do?
flat or 3 bet?
if 3 bet how big? if anyone of them come over the top what do i do?
希望大家踊跃发言.. 我觉得自己打坏了.. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 34 主要不想用QQ 来set farming.. 我一flat, EP 跟进来, 我没位置被他俩夹在中间,太难受了...
这miniraise 再shove,很难读, 可能是AA, AK, 也可能donk shove 烂牌... 这4 bet fold
是真亏..他vpip 20 17 也很松了虽然才没几手牌.
不过这牌可能真是weak tight 一点flat pre 的好.. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 35 what does this mean?
"99 3x from UTG, got mini-raised by UTG, "
do you mean by utg+1 miniraise? |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 36 but you guys play way trickier than us.. lol all the raise miniraise, small
bet, induce etc...
i think we played this hand pretty straight forward even though the end
results are the same....
There is really no need to 3 bet mini for induce there at river.. just check shove. if he has AK, you could lose value because there is a chance he
might just flat that raise. The problem with small bet then shove is that you look too strong, stronger than check shove in my eyes. Small bet then minirerai |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 37 goes: shake hand.. ^_^
还有, if he miniraise you preflop utg+1 vs your utg raise. You have to put KK in his range even
though Ak AA is also possible..
I also see people flat at button a lot nowadays with KK AA. I actually saw someone mentioned today on 2+2 if button flat then reraise all in vs a 3 bet squeeze, it must be KK+. So keep that in mind... Not like I can avoid this cooler but at least I can think of him having AA KK at this spot... |
|
g**s
发帖数: 1114 | 38 You shove is so nice, dont give this donk a single chance to save money.
thin value bet is so important, all poker bet/raise/fold is about value. If
you like to thin value bet, you have to be well prepared to fold your lovely
hand. otherwise, better just to call. Same thing applies to slow play AA.If
you could not fold AA after flop, better not slow play with it.
value river river.. end up
miniraise to induce..... i never reinduce.. shoooooveeee.....
when you are beat. |
|
p*******p
发帖数: 13670 | 39 你一直是call? 然后river 突然lead? , 没看懂你前面的描述
value river river.. end up
miniraise to induce..... i never reinduce.. shoooooveeee.....
when you are beat. |
|
D*A
发帖数: 1169 | 40 Why do you call turn raise? sounds a -EV
value river river.. end up
miniraise to induce..... i never reinduce.. shoooooveeee.....
when you are beat. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 41 there is no turn raise.. it is a 3$ bet into a 8.5$ pot... seems like a weak
2 barrel..
I actually like how he played AK top pair until the river call shove.. he
actually kept my weaker hand in. It is consistent with my view of not to
over play AK TPTK. the miniraise river is good too because he disguised his hand strength and i could call even with pocket Js, but the call shove is a huge huge huge leak.. it should be a trivial fold.
Normally it is weaker hand weaker bet.. with one over card, i |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 42 No way he is on a draw... 22 or 44, or flopped straight.
i think you can lay down 22.. but can't lay down 33. snap and pray. your
mini check raise is not good. I think that miniraise put you in a very bad
situation, raise to 24$. Drawy board, 1 to act, raise it larger to force bb to play straight forward. BB's stack is so deep, you don't want to give him odds to draw. |
|
s*********k
发帖数: 1989 | 43 what did you indeed do? Fold?
It is callable. Miniraise is awkward, have to say. MP appearantly has
over pair. BB hard to tell, he could has 55, 22/44 etc. THe only thing
you worry is 44 (against 56s/A5s, u still has 33% chance). Most likely
BB has over pair also (55/45s is more possible). |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 44 今天ftp 上的人都象吃了药似的.. 3 bet 4 bet shove一大堆.. 我都不敢偷了...
上来就KK 被AA 灭了一次.. 不过马上AA 灭了一次KK 保本.. 几乎同时AA另一桌被77
preflop miniraise, 我4 bet 后他call.. flop 689. he raise my cbet all in, AA
竟然hold 了.. lucky... 赫赫
好象驴不少啊.. 都来clear bonus了? |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 45 or should we say 驴急跳墙?
he flat preflop miniraise flop check turn but shove all in river.. he knows
he is beat on river, so he wants to turn his hand into a bluff.. 也不想想他
represent 社么牌... 我就担心A10, A10 也不会加那么大注.. snap call..
感谢他的spazz out, 弥补一下刚才KK 被 AK suck-out 的损失.. |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 46 The miniraise pot size c bet with a draw is not a good play. more often you
will get 3 bet out of the pot on flop. If he is bluffing pot size, he will
check fold turn. If he indeed has a strong hand, you take a card with a call
and stack him when you do hit. This fish's flat flop is even worse. Snap
shove or big raise to commit to charge for draws and A top pair and small
set.
over
with
slow |
|
f*****g
发帖数: 15860 | 47 well, to me, "always" = fixed mindset = not an open strategy, hehe.
miniraising
pair
these |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 48 smallish blocking bet is a very exploitable play. It really only work on
fish or weak tight player who are clueless. Because you are simply telling
your opponents that you do not have a very strong hand, but would like see a
showdown. If you have a strong hand, you will never play like this because
the value lost over long term is much bigger. Any time when you tell your
opponents what you have in a game of incomplete information, you lose. Now
all we need to do is shove over his blocking be... 阅读全帖 |
|
s*********k
发帖数: 1989 | 49 Tiny ball on river on river. That way you never regret: fold to shove and
flat call miniraise.
bet |
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 50 还了一半那天live 鱼flat AA out of position 后set over 我set 的债.. |
|
