z*********n
发帖数: 94654 | 1 继续发现很多问题的答案，书里写得清清楚楚
包括版上之前讨论过的好多问题
建议诺诺虚心阅读，很多他本人问过的问题书里原文详细回答
（例如他问过figure 8的问题）
不要总是说什么拿到手就阅读了3次什么的，仔细阅读，word by word
好书，好书
顺便问一个插图是不是画错了
202页，讲到mid rappel停止的几个方法
第一个方法是leg wrap
那个图，怎么brake方向的绳子到了身后了，这个不容易实现吧
你在下降过程中，正常做法，整个绳子系统在身前，怎么要半路停止的时候就能把整个
系统
弄到身后然后腿上绕圈？
感觉还是用autoblock或者prusik结合理，根据另一本书里的推崇，autoblock/prusik
结还有
防止手跟绳子直接接触摩擦过热的好处，而且万一半路落石新手不小心胆小放手能紧急
制动
为什么那天听白菜说autoblock他们实际上用的很少呢，理由是什么呢？ |
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R******e
发帖数: 2254 | 2 没画错
rappel的时候，绳子可以在两腿间，也可以在身侧
在身侧的时候（图中是在左侧），从身后绕半圈，然后在另一测腿上绕几圈
关于autoblock和prusik的事情，我给frank详细讲了，他自己也练习了，你有空可以和
他交流一下
prusik |
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r***t
发帖数: 505 | 3 买了La Sportiva Trango S Evo Gtx"red boots"，昨天club训练在Mount Erie攀岩，
一天下来，回家的时候发现脚板下面都是湿的，和平时穿别的鞋的情况很不一样。按说
应该不是渗水进去，那么就是汗水么？这种情况正常么？
昨天爬的是够烂的，前天滑雪把左脚踝崴了一下，兼之昨天从parking lot下去trail的
时候又往后摔了一下，左边屁股立马疼痛，结果连rappel时候是臀无力加脚无力，练习
捆绑的时候左脚几次滑脱，右脚无法提起，人都swing了，sigh...
所以我在想是不是这种情况下我人本身紧张，汗水分泌也异常了？ |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 4 那个couloir下坡的时候比上坡难，不结组也可以带上绳子，有必要时能rappel下 |
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D****g
发帖数: 2860 | 5 if you haven't done any multi pitch before, your biggest challange might not
be climbing skill itself, but the transition. I guarantee you that you will
literally spend hours on a pitch. You spend so much time on pro placement,
anchor building, sorting out gears, rope management, rappelling. The time
spent on climbing is mostly neglegible. |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 6 Narrows会有点冷，可以在Springdale租dry suit和防水鞋。我们去Subway是提前网上预
订的，走全程要用绳子rappel.
个人体会Utah众多National Park的精华是Zion，因为除了有山有峡谷，还有其它
National Park没有的水，Zion的精华是没多少人去的Subway，美西南摄影的麦加。有
空一定要到Zion门口Springdale的Michael Fatali Gallery看看，彩色风光摄影的最高
峰。（黑白还是Adams)。
本人06年秋天的拍的，供你参考
http://www.flickr.com/photos/kevinqu/sets/72157616397774394/ |
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s****y
发帖数: 2159 | 7 第一次rappel 下你设的anchor 是很心虚的，即使你已经下去了，说明it works了，
老师说不belay 我，要你在下面fire
belay， 我那个害怕啊，心里打鼓。。。哈哈 |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 8 cinch rappel不舒服，不是我一个人觉得难以控制
the
,
Suitable |
|
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h********r
发帖数: 3291 | 10 single rope rappel不是一样下的吗？你是说下来了之后还要想法把绳子取下来？ |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 11 我没说不一样啊
至于是否取绳子，那要看rappel的目的是什么 |
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m***f
发帖数: 732 | 12 跑了，不过开始跑的时候地震也停了。:) 这个至少比rappel快些吧，那个啥火灾的时
候比较有用。 |
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z*********n
发帖数: 94654 | 13 rappel需要double check anchor，做prusik backup结
然后慢慢地往下走，哈哈哈 |
|
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h****m
发帖数: 405 | 15 严重同意！大部分事故都是发生在下扯， rappel的时候的。而且像他这种情况，能不
能安全下来就看运气了。就好象那个四川后生，运气比他就要好。 |
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h****m
发帖数: 405 | 16 严重同意！大部分事故都是发生在下扯， rappel的时候的。而且像他这种情况，能不
能安全下来就看运气了。就好象那个四川后生，运气比他就要好。 |
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c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 17 nice. monkey face has been on my list for a while, just for the long free
hanging rappel
2 |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 18 cinnamon slab那个rappel也是 free hanging, 不过比monkey face稍微短一些
的地 |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 19 看来原计划是rappel to the red saddle, which is to the south side of summit
pinnacle。因为降下来发现还要traverse a 55 slope才能到red saddle，所以改变了
下到white water glacier的路线。很难make all the right moves/decisions，技术
贮备实在太重要了。 |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 20 check this TR:
http://cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=699477
Now, I am pretty sure we used the correct rappel anchor. We were supposed to
traverse to the south, but the condition was too bad to do that.
Also, after checking the book "Oregon High", I found the name of our descent
route: Whitewater Headwall. It says Avoid this route after June.
summit
变了
技术 |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 21 7mm rope is strong enough. actually, you can hang your body weight on 5mm
cord without any problem
rappel |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 22 In case different rappel route is used, the rope has much less chance to get
stuck. I don't day it never happened, but really rare |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 23 alternatively, you can use 7mm rope as retrieve line, and do sngle rope
rappel
In this case, you need a butterfly knot with a locking biner
connect
rope,
the |
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p*******r
发帖数: 180 | 24 Thanks for sharing. It'd be interesting to see how many died from vehicular
accidents on their way home from climbs. Fatigue + sleep deprivation + late
night sent a lot of ppl to hell. John Bachar almost died from a few years
ago.
Btw, if I may, it is spelled rappel. |
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p**********t
发帖数: 2636 | 25 这个统计里面的大部分都是park ranger提交的报告，出了公园门他们就不知情了。
第一次发现居然是rappel...blush
俺属于那种不睡够觉很少开车的，不行就在trail head睡，不过可能也是我从来不需要
赶回家上班。当学生好啊
vehicular
late |
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S********t
发帖数: 18987 | 26 你得去啊,负责爬墙,
我大约查了一下,
有两个地方,,有足够新手和高手路线
wall street
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/utah/moab_area/potash_road/105716961
Ice Cream Parlor
http://www.mountainproject.com/v/utah/moab_area/kane_springs_canyon/105716967
都是我打电话从当地向导那里诓出来的信息,
另外值得注目的是canyoneering
有个路线是,lomatium CYN,号称the best adventurous day hike in Moab
http://www.deserthighlights.com/trips/cynring/oneday.htm#lomatium
http://www.flickr.com/photos/spinstertasha/sets/72157619117124796/
由于这次有会水人才+攀岩人才,还可以考虑CANYONEERING,会RAPPEL就可以
不过还是建议弄 |
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w***y
发帖数: 1313 | 27 没用过
按照说明的话没问题
Black Diamond ATC Guide Belay Device Specs
Specification Description
Weight 102 grams
Fits rope sizes 7.7mm - 11mm, single/double
Suitable for belaying Yes
Suitable for rappelling Yes |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 28 还好, 爬multi pitch的时候, 我目前还没遇到需要着急找中点的时候, 准备single
rope rappel需要快速找中点的时候, 我想出了一个土办法解决
明显 |
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c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 29 Yes, you will need two ropes. I strongly recommend against doing double rope
rappel from the top of pitch 2. there is an intermediate rap station and you
can do 2 single raps. The team before us got their rope stuck twice. We
untangled for them. The second time, the rope was stuck so bad in multiple
places. I almost thought it was a goner. I put all the weight of my fat ass
to get it out. |
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c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 30 A few questions wrt the TR:
1. why did they bring a 13cm screw in the first place anyway?
2. why did they leave a screw instead of using a v-thread to rappel?
3. when they were not able to retreive the webbing (I guess it was frozen),
why did they leave a biner? they could have threaded the rope through the
webbing. |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 31 SCMA每隔一周上次课，其它基本跟同事一起玩。
SCMA很拽的要求，从来没听说哪个Mountaineering/climbing association门槛这么高
http://www.rockclimbing.org/membership.htm
There are two possible paths to become an SCMA member:
Safety Test for Experienced Climbers
Do you have at least two or more years of experience in either leading or
following multi-pitch traditional climbs? Can you tie a bowline, prusik knot
, grapevine knot and a clove hitch? Are you competent at rappelling,
prusiking, and setting safe multi-pitch belay anchors? You may |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 32 They didn't plan ahead for the climb. Instead, they simply followed an
experienced climber to climb chair peak. After they summited, they used the
wrong rappel anchor and went off route. They descended to another base in
darkness.
Luckily, they made right decision to stay overnight and found their way out
the next morning, when they met the S&R
night
I |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 33 Yep, that was another technical error.
The author was the least experienced ppl in the team. I can not imagine how
he set up the rappel anchor.
looks
he
got |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 34 首先要买两根才能玩，其次现在不咋玩wandering alpine route，也就是rappel快点 |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 35 一直用BD Rocklock做主锁，没啥不满，除了沉甸甸。rack虽然小，可是拎起来还是挺
沉。爬multi pitch或alpine rock，准备把ATC XP放家，用ATC。有没有人用BD Vaporlock或DMM Sentinel这样的小
锁做主锁？有什么潜在问题？
BD Vaporlock是这样说的：
# Increases friction up to 30% when lowering or rappelling with an ATC
# Munter Hitch compatible on ropes up to 9.4 mm |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 36 我用rocklock做munter hitch rappel的时候，看着小命整个挂在一个biner上，还是有
点uncomfortable，换成vaporlock估计要nervous了。但是换成用ATC立马很comfortable |
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f********t
发帖数: 4574 | 37 只有绳子绕着biner，biner受弯曲/扭转力量(out of biner plane loading,twisting)，看着有点悬。用ATC时biner
主要受拉力（in plane loading,biner的设计承力模式），另外摩擦力会大很多。
还有free rappel的时候，身体会围着绳子转动，怎样减小或防止转动？是不是扔绳子
前work out twists会好很多
bi |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 38 其实是心理作用，biner gate合上的时候，哪那么容易会变形
不过用munter的时候，要盯着点看gate别被误打开
free rappel的时候转就转了，其实没所谓，基本上没法避免。
biner |
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c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 39 Biner上的沟主要是rappel磨出来的吧。从能感觉到沟到不能用估计还得有好几个
season。Biner还是不能算消耗品。 |
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c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 40 我看过一些测试数据，不是官方的。他们拿了一些磨损了1/2-1/3的biner测试，
breaking strength都超过了原来标定的值。毕竟这玩意儿都是金属家伙，一根铁丝咱
赤手空拳都拉不断呢。rappel的时候也就body weight，加上bouncing不会超过2x，2kN
到顶了。ANAM上没有读到过biner fail的案例，也从来没听说的。倒是旧的runner我比
较担心，那玩意儿不经造。
另外一个myth是关于dropped biner，测试数据表明从el cap扔到yosemite valley的
biner强度没有任何损失 |
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c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 41 I'm still confused. Why would you need to clean a weighted draw on rappel?
Unless you are rapping on single strand and the other strand is fixed on the
floor. |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 42 没时间详细写，写个简单的TR吧
路线： Mt.Hood Wy'East
早晨2:40出发，Trail head 5900ft, 4am到7600ft，从那里向东，下降400ft到white
river glacier，然后上到 white river glacier和Newton Clark glacier之间的ridge
， 从那里沿着40度左右的雪坡一直到summit ridge(10000ft), 沿着summit ridge一路
向北向上，早晨10点半到10800ft，离顶峰还有几百尺，这里是crux，55度左右的雪坡
，下面是悬崖，设了两根绳子的fixed line，10个人的大group通过这段很慢，从第一
个人开始lead，到最后一个人通过，用了3个半小时。过了crux，再往上走几分钟就登
顶了。 下午3点登顶，然后从南线Pearly gate rappel/down climb, 到hogsback，4pm
回到hogsback，5:50pm回到trail head
Total elevation gain 5700ft
总共用时15小时10分
Gear notes: |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 43 the one used for rappelling on Jefferson?
it. |
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f********r
发帖数: 3155 | 44 Rocklock这样的大且重的HMS locker，除了belay/rappel还能干啥 |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 45 你要是准备夜里rappel的话，有Icon会安全很多 |
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b***y
发帖数: 824 | 46 While, we picked up few booties in SEWS climb. Other people bailed, and
sounds like rappelled on a nut. |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 47 I don't remember there is any fixed rappel anchor on the first belay station
of Moscow, did you leave any gears?
climbing
she
from
ledge
from
the
No |
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b***y
发帖数: 824 | 48 Climber leader made a wise decision to cancel the alpine climb due to AV
danger. We head back to Mazama Rock this weekend. Following Rotatezh's steps
, went on to Prime Rib.
11 pitches up: 5.5 hours. Down with endless rappels: 3.5 hours. 10 hours car
to car.
Led 6 pitches, LD led 5. Mostly 5.6, 5.7 moves, 1 pitch sustained 5.8+, last
pitch solid 5.9
6, 7th pitch can be linked if bring enough draws or skipped bolts
9, 10th pitch can be linked if using a double before turning 120 degree
8, 9, 10th |
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p**********t
发帖数: 2636 | 49
empty.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~I felt exactly the same
rappelling down in dark!! Don't want to do it any more. I caught my hair,
tangled the rope...Even my partner noticed that I was getting dizzy
Small |
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T*********e
发帖数: 39815 | 50 为啥剪？
glacier travel 70m有点长
alpine rock的话，70还不错，rappel的距离还长了 |
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