o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 1 今天打意大利打得不错
就是有一副亏大发了的牌
连老板(W)
S: K98xxx
H: VOID
D: AQJT
C: Q63
施豪军(E)
S: QTx
H: KJ
D: 87
C: KT87xx
E dealer, NS VUL
N E S W
- 1H 1S
2H 2S X 4S
5H - - 5S
- - x //
谁来点评一下这个叫牌 | p***r
发帖数: 20570 | 2 It is usually a good idea to bid 4D instead of 4S to show a very important
side suit. Later, you can easily pass 5H to defend. 4S should show a one
suiter usually.
【在 o*******n 的大作中提到】
: 今天打意大利打得不错
: 就是有一副亏大发了的牌
: 连老板(W)
: S: K98xxx
: H: VOID
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: 施豪军(E)
: S: QTx
: H: KJ
| o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 3 你想象一下布吉拿着什么牌有局叫的5H
呵呵
【在 p***r 的大作中提到】
: It is usually a good idea to bid 4D instead of 4S to show a very important
: side suit. Later, you can easily pass 5H to defend. 4S should show a one
: suiter usually.
| p***r
发帖数: 20570 | 4 I saw the hand. Actually after 4D and later 5H, east can probably double it
.
Now this 4S bid doesn't mean much, just an offensive oriented hand. So the
key is still to bid 4D instead of 4S. Even a very zhengzhi 3D should work.
【在 o*******n 的大作中提到】
: 你想象一下布吉拿着什么牌有局叫的5H
: 呵呵
| o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 5 我当时就是想着叫3D来着
it
【在 p***r 的大作中提到】
: I saw the hand. Actually after 4D and later 5H, east can probably double it
: .
: Now this 4S bid doesn't mean much, just an offensive oriented hand. So the
: key is still to bid 4D instead of 4S. Even a very zhengzhi 3D should work.
| a****s
发帖数: 524 | 6 How could you guys watch vugraph in working hours? :-)
【在 o*******n 的大作中提到】
: 今天打意大利打得不错
: 就是有一副亏大发了的牌
: 连老板(W)
: S: K98xxx
: H: VOID
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: 施豪军(E)
: S: QTx
: H: KJ
| o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 7 你的上班时间
我的睡觉时间好不好
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: How could you guys watch vugraph in working hours? :-)
| p***r
发帖数: 20570 | 8 I didn't watch any vugraph!
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: How could you guys watch vugraph in working hours? :-)
| a****s
发帖数: 524 | 9 I am speechless.
S: K98xxx
H: ----
D: AQJT
C: Q63
put yourself in his shoes, after
(1H) 1S (2H) 2S
X ?
how could anyone in his right mind wants to bid 3D (or 4D, for that mater)
at all? what you thinking? slam? or stay out of game?
it's nothing else but a straightforward 4S.
It muddled the water a bit, but that's exactly what you wanted at the moment
, did't you?
Now only because the next guy throw in 5H give you a problem, and looks like
you have to guess in dark, you guys suggest we ditch the 4S bid and the
sound strategy behind it altogether.
It's not a guess, not even a problem, it's a no brainer.
The opener is unlikely to have much shape, because he doubled, instead of
bidding a new suit over 2S.
Now how do you think of a guy would suddenly look so confident on making 5H,
yet only raised 2H earlier.
Bocchi just wanted to say: "I am from the nuthouse"
Lian rouyang: "No you are not, I am".
【在 o*******n 的大作中提到】
: 我当时就是想着叫3D来着
:
: it
| m****r
发帖数: 6639 | 10 i'd pass the x, and maybe we play 2sx?
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: I am speechless.
: S: K98xxx
: H: ----
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: put yourself in his shoes, after
: (1H) 1S (2H) 2S
: X ?
: how could anyone in his right mind wants to bid 3D (or 4D, for that mater)
: at all? what you thinking? slam? or stay out of game?
| | | o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 11 这不是你说的吗
自然描述啊
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: I am speechless.
: S: K98xxx
: H: ----
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: put yourself in his shoes, after
: (1H) 1S (2H) 2S
: X ?
: how could anyone in his right mind wants to bid 3D (or 4D, for that mater)
: at all? what you thinking? slam? or stay out of game?
| p***r
发帖数: 20570 | 12 This is simply the wrong bidding philosophy. Bridge is a partnership game.
What 4S achieves is just that I think I have an offensive oriented hand, if
they can make 4H, our 4S shouldn't be too expensive. It doesn't show your
shape, which can be very important for partner to get involved at high
levels. 4D shows a respectable hand, so partner can double their 5H with
suitable hands and 4S can be bid based on 7 spades, only 11 HCPs, like
KQxxxxx x KQJ xx. Here, no matter what they make, you know you won't go down
too much in 4S. It doesn't show any extra, doesn't show any side suit
information and it doesn't ask partner to get involved if they compete to 5H
.
The intrinsic bid for this hand is only 3D IMO, because this hand is not
strong enough to commit to 4S. You need a pretty good dummy to have a play
in 4S, for example: Axx xxx Kxxx Jxx (facing this hand, even if you just
invite, your partner would very likely bid 4S anyway). If partner holds
values in H, you can easily go down 2 tricks and nobody can make anything if
partner is short in D. (And the worst case is when partner holds Sxxx, opp
holds SAQJ or even SAQJT behind you.)
4D is good in a sense to show that you have a nice hand to commit to 4S,
which is a slight overbid. However, it takes up a lot of bidding space and
pass the correct shape information to partner. Suppose you bid 4D, it really
doesn't need a genius from partner's position to double opp's 5H because he
knows you have a reasonable 4 card side suit and they may have a few losers
in D if he holds Dxx or Dx.
In this sense, your proposed 4S is only two bids higher than 4D and doesn't
pass any distributional information, that's why I call this as bad bridge.
This is not a hand that your side is significantly weaker than your opps, so
you really should make descriptive bids and help partner to make
intelligent decisions if opps bid at 5 level. Also, after your 4D, I don't
even think Bocchi is brave enough to bid 5H, which may suffer a huge loss.
Your 4S actually says "I don't know whose hand it belongs to", 5H says "I
like my chance, and I don't think you can double me easily". 4D says "we
are likely to have a better hand and I have a good D suit, so I bid it to
help your evaluation". 3D also says the similar thing but the overall
playing strength is weaker.
The huge disaster just happens because you make a very lazy bid of 4S, which
invites good players to explore the vulnerability of it with some suitable
hands.
Bridge bidding theory has evolved a lot in recent years and a seemingly
crazy bid of 5H indeed is a very nice attempt to trick not so good bidders
into wrong decisions.
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: I am speechless.
: S: K98xxx
: H: ----
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: put yourself in his shoes, after
: (1H) 1S (2H) 2S
: X ?
: how could anyone in his right mind wants to bid 3D (or 4D, for that mater)
: at all? what you thinking? slam? or stay out of game?
| b***y
发帖数: 2804 | 13 4D puts partner into the picture when there is more bidding. When bidding is
at high-level, it is very important to assess the degree of fit (in side
suits). It should not be regarded as slam try. The problem is that many
partnerships play 4D as splinter, so they have to start with 3D, which gives
opps too much room. Still, you have the boss suit, it is usually not a very
big issue.
4S is not without merit though. It blocks 4H and puts more pressure to the
opps. But be aware that it doesn't guarantee that opps will make the last
guess (just look at this hand, eventually West made the last guess).
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: I am speechless.
: S: K98xxx
: H: ----
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: put yourself in his shoes, after
: (1H) 1S (2H) 2S
: X ?
: how could anyone in his right mind wants to bid 3D (or 4D, for that mater)
: at all? what you thinking? slam? or stay out of game?
| b***y
发帖数: 2804 | 14 呵呵，一直以为中国还是内部挑选。看来终于向美国学习，也采用选拔淘汰了。
【在 o*******n 的大作中提到】
: 今天打意大利打得不错
: 就是有一副亏大发了的牌
: 连老板(W)
: S: K98xxx
: H: VOID
: D: AQJT
: C: Q63
: 施豪军(E)
: S: QTx
: H: KJ
| o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 15 选拔国家集训队，然后从集训队里内部挑选
【在 b***y 的大作中提到】
: 呵呵，一直以为中国还是内部挑选。看来终于向美国学习，也采用选拔淘汰了。
| b***y
发帖数: 2804 | 16 那怎么还有老板？
【在 o*******n 的大作中提到】
: 选拔国家集训队，然后从集训队里内部挑选
| o*******n
发帖数: 6500 | 17 他是浙江竞帆队的出资人
选拔赛进入集训队
【在 b***y 的大作中提到】
: 那怎么还有老板？
| a****s
发帖数: 524 | 18 It's funny to think Bocchi had some clever maneuver in this hand.
I haven't seen the hand records, but it's clear to me he did something
stupid, either the earlier 2H or the final 5H, because they just don't add
up.
Bocchi's mistake, is at least partly caused by the swift 4S bid. Yet we are
suggested better not put him under such pressure because..., we can beat him
square and fair anyway?
The philosophy to continue the auction "scientifically" regardless whether
we can land the final contract immediately, send chill up my spine, because
I am really frightened where this can lead to.
Philosophy aside, after (1H) 1S (2H) 2S, (X), why could one feel the the
slightest urgency of being prepared for the imminent high level competition
is completely mysterious to me.
No one at the table, I dare say, was at the moment expecting 5H from Bocchi.
It's a shame that Lian Laoban failed to draw such inference flying in his
face.
Obviously, things are not getting any better with the hindsight, now, thanks
to the DNA evidence, the innocent 4S bid was identified as the culprit.
if
down
5H
【在 p***r 的大作中提到】
: This is simply the wrong bidding philosophy. Bridge is a partnership game.
: What 4S achieves is just that I think I have an offensive oriented hand, if
: they can make 4H, our 4S shouldn't be too expensive. It doesn't show your
: shape, which can be very important for partner to get involved at high
: levels. 4D shows a respectable hand, so partner can double their 5H with
: suitable hands and 4S can be bid based on 7 spades, only 11 HCPs, like
: KQxxxxx x KQJ xx. Here, no matter what they make, you know you won't go down
: too much in 4S. It doesn't show any extra, doesn't show any side suit
: information and it doesn't ask partner to get involved if they compete to 5H
: .
| p***r
发帖数: 20570 | 19 He had something like Jx T9xxx Kxxx Jx. The point here is that 4S doesn't
show much of a hand, so it's relatively easy to bid 5H over 4S, which is
very difficult to get penalized, especially for somebody like the Italian
guys, who don't have a crazy bidder image. Also when white vs. red, opps
often like to take some insurance to bid 5S back.
If you think deep, you would really appreciate such kind of bids. This kind
of bids actually happen everyday at the table. I remember once Weishu
confidently bid a grand slam without control in opps suit and induced an
unsuccessful sac from opps.
You usually should assume players like Bocchi don't make obvious low level
mistakes at bidding because of his bridge ability. With that in mind,
everything may add up and you may have a chance to understand what's really
going on at the table.
are
him
because
【在 a****s 的大作中提到】
: It's funny to think Bocchi had some clever maneuver in this hand.
: I haven't seen the hand records, but it's clear to me he did something
: stupid, either the earlier 2H or the final 5H, because they just don't add
: up.
: Bocchi's mistake, is at least partly caused by the swift 4S bid. Yet we are
: suggested better not put him under such pressure because..., we can beat him
: square and fair anyway?
: The philosophy to continue the auction "scientifically" regardless whether
: we can land the final contract immediately, send chill up my spine, because
: I am really frightened where this can lead to.
|
|
