R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 1 Problem (1) Foreknowledge
4: 10 Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that i
s saying to you, 'Give me a drink,' you would have asked him, and he would h
ave given you living water."
The Woman of Samaria finally called Jesus prophet and guessed he was the Chr
ist, because Jesus knew all of her past life. John 4:10 seems to me that Je
sus knew this woman did NOT know "the gift of God", and therefore Jesus talk
ed a lot of things to her showing his wisdom and foreknowledge.
4:48 So Jesus said to him, "Unless you see signs and wonders you will not be
lieve."
Another miracle Jesus made at Capernaum. John 4:48 shows that Jesus knew th
e official would not believe in his name without showing him the miracle.
The Woman of Samaria and the official of Capernaum are just like us. How ca
n we believe in Jesus's name unless we see signs and wonders? Seeketernal o
ften said it is our responsibility to accept the Jesus Christ as savior. Is
n't it also a hard job for Jesus himself to make them believe him?
Another related question is whether Jesus "opened" their heart (to make them
believe in him) or not? Calvinists always say regeneration comes before fa
ith. But John 4:10 and John 4:48 are just examples of using miracle and for
eknowledge to convert people.
Problem (2)
4:38 I sent you to reap that for which you did not labor. Others have labore
d, and you have entered into their labor."
What does this verse mean? | m****a
发帖数: 9485 | 2 thanks for sharing,appreciate your insight.
salvation is a choice, it is a gift, anyone can decide---if you wanted to
repent your sins, gladly accept Jesus's atonement, or, stand in from of God,
and take the sinful deeds you did upon yourself.
salvation is a merciful and loving arrangement for all people, anyone can
accept it, anyone can be converted.
there is great judgement day in the future---after millennium, according
everyone's works and deeds and their wills.meanwhile Jesus will start to
judge all Christians first--start from the beginning of the millennium.---
judgement will start from "the house of the God".
after the great judgement day, there are different kingdoms we can choose to
living for eternity, abiding different laws. | R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 3 Agree
God is love, God is justice
God,
【在 m****a 的大作中提到】
: thanks for sharing,appreciate your insight.
: salvation is a choice, it is a gift, anyone can decide---if you wanted to
: repent your sins, gladly accept Jesus's atonement, or, stand in from of God,
: and take the sinful deeds you did upon yourself.
: salvation is a merciful and loving arrangement for all people, anyone can
: accept it, anyone can be converted.
: there is great judgement day in the future---after millennium, according
: everyone's works and deeds and their wills.meanwhile Jesus will start to
: judge all Christians first--start from the beginning of the millennium.---
: judgement will start from "the house of the God".
| j*****6
发帖数: 1059 | 4 1
a) 当然要有记号，每个得救的基督徒都要有见证的。
罗 8:16 圣灵与我们的心同证我们是 神的儿女；
b) 弗 2:8 你们得救是本乎恩，也因着信，这并不是出于自己，乃是 神所赐的；
罗 1:17 因为 神的义正在这福音上显明出来；这义是本于信，以致于信。如经上所记
：“义人必因信得生。”
本于信以致于信，两个信不一样的。
2 大家互为同工，为神做事。别人之前的劳动我们享受其成果。
林前 3:6 我栽种了，亚波罗浇灌了，惟有 神叫他生长。 林前 3:7 可见栽种的算不
得什么，浇灌的也算不得什么；只在那叫他生长的 神。 林前 3:8 栽种的和浇灌的，
都是一样；但将来各人要照自己的工夫得自己的赏赐。 林前 3:9 因为我们是与 神同
工的；你们是 神所耕种的田地，所建造的房屋。
约 4:35 你们岂不说：‘到收割的时候，还有四个月’吗？我告诉你们，举目向田观看
，庄稼已经熟了(原文作“发白”)，可以收割了。 约 4:36 收割的人得工价，积蓄五谷
到永生，叫撒种的和收割的一同快乐。 约 4:37 俗语说：‘那人撒种，这人收割，’这
话可见是真的。 约 4:38 我差你们去收你们所没有劳苦的；别人劳苦，你们享受他们所
劳苦的。
i
h
Chr
Je
talk
be
【在 R*o 的大作中提到】
: Problem (1) Foreknowledge
: 4: 10 Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that i
: s saying to you, 'Give me a drink,' you would have asked him, and he would h
: ave given you living water."
: The Woman of Samaria finally called Jesus prophet and guessed he was the Chr
: ist, because Jesus knew all of her past life. John 4:10 seems to me that Je
: sus knew this woman did NOT know "the gift of God", and therefore Jesus talk
: ed a lot of things to her showing his wisdom and foreknowledge.
: 4:48 So Jesus said to him, "Unless you see signs and wonders you will not be
: lieve."
| R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 5 my point was that these two stories show that faith proceeds a miracle. We
ordinary people want to see miracles before accpeting Jesus. Most of Christ
ians' testimonies are also based on some miracles, but not convincing enough
.
My wife's first visa application was rejected. My Christian suggested her t
o pray to God. But she went to a Buddhist temple. Her second visa applicat
ion was easily approved. She thanked Buddha a lot. :D
【在 j*****6 的大作中提到】
: 1
: a) 当然要有记号，每个得救的基督徒都要有见证的。
: 罗 8:16 圣灵与我们的心同证我们是 神的儿女；
: b) 弗 2:8 你们得救是本乎恩，也因着信，这并不是出于自己，乃是 神所赐的；
: 罗 1:17 因为 神的义正在这福音上显明出来；这义是本于信，以致于信。如经上所记
: ：“义人必因信得生。”
: 本于信以致于信，两个信不一样的。
: 2 大家互为同工，为神做事。别人之前的劳动我们享受其成果。
: 林前 3:6 我栽种了，亚波罗浇灌了，惟有 神叫他生长。 林前 3:7 可见栽种的算不
: 得什么，浇灌的也算不得什么；只在那叫他生长的 神。 林前 3:8 栽种的和浇灌的，
| j*****6
发帖数: 1059 | 6 我觉得是这样的：
首先信了，然后有见证，然后信了。
知识和神迹不能让人得救，但是可以坚固人的信心。
林前 1:19 就如经上所记：“我要灭绝智慧人的智慧，废弃聪明人的聪明。” 林前 1
:20 智慧人在哪里？文士在哪里？这世上的辩士在哪里？ 神岂不是叫这世上的智慧变
成愚拙吗？ 林前 1:21 世人凭自己的智慧，既不认识 神， 神就乐意用人所当作愚拙
的道理拯救那些信的人；这就是 神的智慧了。 林前 1:22 犹太人是要神迹，希腊人是
求智慧； 林前 1:23 我们却是传钉十字架的基督，在犹太人为绊脚石，在外邦人为愚拙
； 林前 1:24 但在那蒙召的，无论是犹太人、希腊人，基督总为 神的能力， 神的智
慧。 林前 1:25 因 神的愚拙总比人智慧； 神的软弱总比人强壮。
路 11:29 当众人聚集的时候，耶稣开讲说：“这世代是一个邪恶的世代；他们求看神迹
，除了约拿的神迹以外，再没有神迹给他们看。
We
Christ
enough
t
applicat
【在 R*o 的大作中提到】
: my point was that these two stories show that faith proceeds a miracle. We
: ordinary people want to see miracles before accpeting Jesus. Most of Christ
: ians' testimonies are also based on some miracles, but not convincing enough
: .
: My wife's first visa application was rejected. My Christian suggested her t
: o pray to God. But she went to a Buddhist temple. Her second visa applicat
: ion was easily approved. She thanked Buddha a lot. :D
| R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 7 I know your point
I just let you know the stories in John 4 are not like this way.
1
愚拙
人是
愚拙
的智
神迹
【在 j*****6 的大作中提到】
: 我觉得是这样的：
: 首先信了，然后有见证，然后信了。
: 知识和神迹不能让人得救，但是可以坚固人的信心。
: 林前 1:19 就如经上所记：“我要灭绝智慧人的智慧，废弃聪明人的聪明。” 林前 1
: :20 智慧人在哪里？文士在哪里？这世上的辩士在哪里？ 神岂不是叫这世上的智慧变
: 成愚拙吗？ 林前 1:21 世人凭自己的智慧，既不认识 神， 神就乐意用人所当作愚拙
: 的道理拯救那些信的人；这就是 神的智慧了。 林前 1:22 犹太人是要神迹，希腊人是
: 求智慧； 林前 1:23 我们却是传钉十字架的基督，在犹太人为绊脚石，在外邦人为愚拙
: ； 林前 1:24 但在那蒙召的，无论是犹太人、希腊人，基督总为 神的能力， 神的智
: 慧。 林前 1:25 因 神的愚拙总比人智慧； 神的软弱总比人强壮。
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