g****l 发帖数: 644 | 1 VO2 is your oxygen consumption, VO2max is the max - an indicator of your
aerobic capacity
可是,你游泳跑步都那么猛,2000米的游,15迈的跑
你的VO2max肯定比45要高,心率根本就没有push上去
我记得我25岁的时候两年没锻炼过,肥到BMI 26,VO2max还有43
下次换个treadmill的再测测
我觉得你应该是50以上 :P
小时 |
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g****l 发帖数: 644 | 2 LoL. I love VO2max, but the VO2max test on the treadmill tho.
I even beg our physical activity testing team to put me on the treadmill to
do a VO2max test with mask.
because |
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w****1 发帖数: 4931 | 3 I think my vo2max will decline if I stop doing intervals for a while and
only do long runs. although, the base
training may still improve my "base vo2max". an article on running times
talked about how a cross country
team is put to a time trial at the beginning of the season, while the
runners were not allowed to run intervals
in preparation for it. It's basically saying that intervals are so effective
in improving vo2max that it's almost
like cheating. on the other hand, it would only give you ... 阅读全帖 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 4 different sports have different vo2max, cycling vo2max can't be translated
into running vo2max directly (e.g. Lance). |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 5 这不是练vo2max,这比vo2max要短要快,主要练speed和economy的。
vo2max必须要持续好几分钟才能练到,一般都是800m-1600m interval。 |
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m**t 发帖数: 1956 | 6 首先感谢变叔等一干人,不是他们怂恿,我估计不会去拼破三。
我的训练方法跟Advanced Marathon 55mpw。
1) 训练方法
AM书上有很多种类,easy/recovery, easy with 8x100 stride, vo2max (5x1000m at
5K pace), LT/tempo/tuneup race, medium long, long run, long run at MP
easy with 8x100 stride,这个我感觉没啥用,据说能防止peak,我觉得自己跑着玩,
peak就peak了。也就没练。就全easy了。tune-up race不是容易找,就跑tempo。早期
有点14-16mile的medium run,就全归成long run了。 long run at MP 不可能经常练
,当个评估还可以。所以我就分成4类:
A easy/recovery, B, vo2max, C tempo, D long run
首先C&D。现在回想,这两种训练应该最重要的。我看我比赛的pace,集中在[MP-15se,
MP+15se]。这个上限就... 阅读全帖 |
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W***i 发帖数: 833 | 7 算了,我还是再贴一遍,
Your friendly beginning runner's guide to .... runner's jargon.
You'll notice we don't have a FAQ here -- that's because we want you to ask
your questions, join in, become part of the community! That said, I am sure
new runners get overwhelmed by phrases we throw around all the time here wit
h impunity; you probably think we're all speaking some strange language. To
follow along here, it's really helpful just to know some general stuff and w
hat terms mean. So in the interest of hel... 阅读全帖 |
|
m**t 发帖数: 1956 | 8 long run
很有争议的就是不跑20miler,16miler就够了。
首先,作者说,1)jack daniels说了,单个long run不能超过周里程的25%-30%;2)
传奇体育生理学家Tim Noakes说了,75%-85%VO2Max 跑2个小时以上,会导致greatest
glycogen depletion。别的研究人员也有同样的结论。过量的glycogen depletion导致
需要很长时间,72小时以上,的恢复。
如果按照25-30%算,周里程55的,最长16.5mile,70周历程的,21mile。所以对50-
60mpw的训练计划,Hansons认为16mile就够了。另外按照8分的pace跑16mile,要2小时
8分钟,从时间上也够了。
其次,Hansons的训练计划,也使得完成20miler比较困难。50多mpw(beginner)的计划
,在后期常有这样的训练:
星期天 16mile
星期1 5mile easy
2 3x2mi at mp-10s pace, 800m recovery, 1-2mi warmup&cooldown
3 off
4... 阅读全帖 |
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m**t 发帖数: 1956 | 9 训练
Hansons把训练分成两类, easy run 和 something of substance SOS。
一个星期,3个SOS,3个easy,一天休息。如果有体力的,休息那天也可以跑。
easy run
虽然easy不是 something of substance,但显然是不可或缺。Hansons指导,easy
pace应该在mp+1min到mp+2min之间。如果累呢,跑得慢一点,slow easy。如果恢复的
好的,可以快一点,fast easy。对于整个训练周期,作者的实践是,前期的easy慢一
些,后期的easy都在mp+90s以内。Hansons认为跑的太慢,没有好处,不能提高有氧能
力,只在摧残你的韧带和骨骼。
对beginner,距离在5-8迈。有经验的,距离在6-10迈。如果再要加,控制时间在2个半
小时以内。作者的实践是跑1个半小时。
SOS
三种SOS,
I)speed/strength, 就是interval。speed是short interval, 1迈以内。strenght是
long interval,1迈以上。
II)tempo,就是MP。h... 阅读全帖 |
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M**u 发帖数: 10158 | 10 是我看错了
第一次tune up/long隔rest 1天VO2max
第二次tune up/long隔rest 2天VO2max
第三次3天VO2max |
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l***h 发帖数: 9308 | 11 marathon pace
跑步黑话大全
Your friendly beginning runner's guide to .... runner's jargon. Cool
You'll notice we don't have a FAQ here -- that's because we want you to ask
your questions, join in, become part of the community! That said, I am sure
new runners get overwhelmed by phrases we throw around all the time here wit
h impunity; you probably think we're all speaking some strange language. To
follow along here, it's really helpful just to know some general stuff and w
hat terms mean. So in the in... 阅读全帖 |
|
p******y 发帖数: 251 | 12 Paper: Metabolic Factors Limiting Performance in Marathon Runners by
Benjamin I. Rapoport
Link: http://www.ploscompbiol.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pcbi.1000960
这里只附上几张图做个例子,有兴趣的同学可以通过上面的连接找到全文,把个性化的
参数输入公式可以得到更准确的结果。
1)Estimate theoretical VO2max using simple treadmill test
2)Estimate running efficiency (this is not included in the paper. I thought
we can use the VO2max calculated from race performances divided by the
VO2max from this approach to estimate running efficiency. This... 阅读全帖 |
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R*****s 发帖数: 41236 | 13 昨儿看Hansons书里说,VO2max是区别National class和recreational runner
的东西,LT是区别第1名和第10名的东西...
elite marathoner的VO2max好像是70-75...VO2max最高的是5K elite, 85.. |
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M*******T 发帖数: 492 | 14 Answer is yes and no.
It's true that fat burning zone is lower then cardio zone (Also you can
notice that in most of the machines,
there is a chart.)
Let's just look at an example.
If you take a look at any professional athlete, except Japanese Summer
Wrestlers. They tend to have very
low body fat percentage. When you take a look at their training, they all do
heavy cardio workout,
plyometrics and so on. Also, the sports they play will most likely put them
in their 70% - 90% VO2Max
(Sprinters, t... 阅读全帖 |
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h*****a 发帖数: 1992 | 15 其实那人上坡跑步超我,我一点也不奇怪。因为上山到最后比的就是power-to-weight
ratio, 而这个数字又是跟VO2max直接相关的。跑步的牛人VO2max都太大了,我比不了
的。
我不练习腿部力量,当然我不是正儿八经训练的。
我觉得变叔你可能是还没习惯骑车。以后每周骑百来麦,平路,高踏频 (90+ rpm), 5-
6个小时,一个月之内你就不会有腿部力量不够的感觉了。 |
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m**k 发帖数: 18660 | 16 【 以下文字转载自 Running 讨论区 】
发信人: mark (花生,微爷远爷的爸爸), 信区: Running
标 题: VDOT 有氧能力指标
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Sun May 27 11:43:42 2007), 转信
这个是出自
http://www.runningtimesmagazine.com/rt/articles/?c=149&id=7482
本来VO2Max是运动的时候可以最大使用氧气的能力.
(当然和你economy有关系 所以一般测出来是Pseudo VO2Max)
Jack Daniels 就建立这个VDOT表 "V-Dot-O2Max"
你可以看到如果想Boston Qualify.就需要3:10那么就对应VDOT 50
就是说你至少5K需要sub 20.
我觉得5K sub 20只是3:10马拉松的必要条件。
marathon你还是需要mileage..longrun..speedwork(tempo etc)
VDOT 1500m Mile 3,000m 2-mile 5,000m |
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N******p 发帖数: 2777 | 17 有道理。比如说一个普通人VO2max是4 l/min,一个世界级的运动员VO2max是8 l/min。
做同样相对强度的运动,那个运动员的发热量就是普通人的两倍。普通人可能不怎么出
汗,运动员已经大汗淋漓了。所以说不能因为你觉得散热不是问题,散热就不是问题。
more, |
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m*******r 发帖数: 13263 | 18 從wiki上看到的。有沒有人比較過效果?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-intensity_interval_training
Tabata Method
A popular regimen based on a 1996 study[2] uses 20 seconds of ultra-intense
exercise (at 170% of VO2max) followed by 10 seconds of rest, repeated
continuously for 4 minutes (8 cycles). In the original study, athletes using
this method trained 4 times per week, plus another day of steady-state
training, and obtained gains similar to a group of athletes who did steady
state (70% VO2max) training 5 time |
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c******t 发帖数: 1733 | 19 一般hiit要做6组以上,时间在15到20分钟之间,所以每组时间不能超过3分钟。按通常
workout/rest 2:1的比例来算,每组workout不要超过两分钟。
workout只有到一定强度才能算high intensity.对于一般人来说, 一般用一分钟的时
间达到95%的vo2max,休息一分到一分半钟。这样跑步相当于400m到800m的强度。
对于牛人来说,常常20秒钟push到170%的vo2max,然后休息10秒。这基本是100-200m 的
sprint.
所以你跑1mile根本称不上high intensity.超过三分钟的运动,绝大多数是有氧运动。
指教 |
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u******a 发帖数: 7843 | 20 所以本质上所谓的有氧减肥就是最大化vo2max么. 你单位时间内能消耗的热量和vo2max
和有直接关系, 和什么有氧心率根本没太大关系...就是用一切方法提升运动成绩就对
了, 而提升运动成绩应该是有比较复杂的计划, 而不是选一个心率区间然后在那跑吧...
他说, 观察了好多运动员, 发现MAF和运动成绩是正相关. 但是其实你任意取一个心率
区间, 测试运动员在这个心率区间的成绩, 结果一定是和运动成绩正相关. 因为运动成
绩提高了, 自然在所有心率区间都跑得快了.
他没说这牛逼的心率区间是怎么算出来的, 总之是比较难让人相信... |
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d*********e 发帖数: 8525 | 21 40min时间差不多了,身体感觉没事的话可以适当延长。 也不用非得每天锻炼,中间
间隔一两天也问题不大。
就强度来说一般典型的有氧训练是在50-60%VO2max,左右,大致就是MAF了。 以前做
课题的时候 找的实验者 是每天1hr,控制在60%VO2max |
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d*********e 发帖数: 8525 | 22 40min时间差不多了,身体感觉没事的话可以适当延长。 也不用非得每天锻炼,中间
间隔一两天也问题不大。
就强度来说一般典型的有氧训练是在50-60%VO2max,左右,大致就是MAF了。 以前做
课题的时候 找的实验者 是每天1hr,控制在60%VO2max |
|
|
m**k 发帖数: 18660 | 24 这个是出自
http://www.runningtimesmagazine.com/rt/articles/?c=149&id=7482
本来VO2Max是运动的时候可以最大使用氧气的能力.
(当然和你economy有关系 所以一般测出来是Pseudo VO2Max)
Jack Daniels 就建立这个VDOT表 "V-Dot-O2Max"
你可以看到如果想Boston Qualify.就需要3:10那么就对应VDOT 50
就是说你至少5K需要sub 20.
我觉得5K sub 20只是3:10马拉松的必要条件。
marathon你还是需要mileage..longrun..speedwork(tempo etc)
VDOT 1500m Mile 3,000m 2-mile 5,000m 10,000m 15K Half Marathon VDOT
45 5:56 6:25 12:40 13:40 21:50 45:16 69:40 1:40:20 3:28:26 45
46 5:49 6:17 12:26 13 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 25 有太多因素影响running economy/efficiency了。有一些是立竿见影的,例如轻量的跑
鞋和衣服,还有aerodynamic: singlet,short,hair,etc. 有一些需要一点时间,例如
减脂,特别是减双腿上脂肪(想象你的双腿比你的身体多移动多少距离)。还有一些因
素跟biomechanic有关:适当的strength training/flexibility training会有帮助,
strides/repetition workouts会有帮助。据说最有帮助的是consistent high mileage
training。
我觉得running economy甚至比vo2max和LT更值得重视。而且当你变成老手,vo2max和
LT都到顶了的时候,就只有running economy和fat utilization有潜力可挖了。 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 26 我的理解是HR%跟vo2max%差不多是一致的,但是不同人或者同一个人在不同阶段,在同
样的HR%或者vo2max%下脂肪燃烧率是不同的。。。。好绕口 |
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w********a 发帖数: 26 | 27 大家看看这个表准吗?
本人中年wsn, 即使以能跑起来的速度warm up 10分钟之后,
心率就已经接近150,进入hardcore training zone了。
然后我一般以10km/h跑40分钟作为easy run,自己感觉不是很累,
可是最后心率169,也已经进入VO2Max区了。这样还是easy run吗?
我每星期一次的long run是以同样的速度跑80分钟,后40分钟心率
基本上稳定在VO2Max的下限,不再继续爬升。请问根据这样的心率水平,
10km/h的速度对我来说是不是太快了? |
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w*****3 发帖数: 1582 | 28 我recovery,easy run, medium-long, 大部分在anerobic zone,
half-marathon pace, tempo在vo2max
interval开始在vo2max zone, 后来会超过的。 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 29 Now i think it's especially good for ultramarathons and ironmans, which are
raced at lower than 75% VO2max. Its effect on marathon distance, which is
often raced at 85% VO2max, is less obvious though.
But way to go!
see
But |
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y******n 发帖数: 4527 | 30 I looked at the course map and got to know the rolling hills, therefore I
think the bike path is too flat. Good point is that the course is really
close to where I live, so I will train on it. Hope to get used to it.
My concern is the time left for me to train. It is only 7 weeks to go and I
know I should focus on the long runs. The question is if I should ignore or
take it easy for the VO2max session in my training. According to my 5K time,
I think my VO2max is probably good enough for BQ, but |
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J***n 发帖数: 210 | 31 补充一下,本人还算爱运动的,平时做些weight trainng, 有时候跑跑步, BMI 22。
还是有点担心,那我的MAX 是多少? 203+5? 203+10?
对了,我有一只说是可以测量VO2 MAX的Polar手表,很久以前测是四十几,最近测的是
55,说是elite程度。VO2MAX不是有氧运动能力的一个标尺吗? 为什么我的VO2MAX较高
但心脏跳这么快? - 估计POLAR太不准。 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 32 那个vo2max没什么用的。跑个比赛来测Vo2max吧。
,
,
women
the |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 33 think about that his vo2max is as high as 85, then his marathon time
improvement would be decent, but not impressive. it's like for me to improve
from 4:00 to 3:40...(assuming my vo2max is 60). |
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R*****s 发帖数: 41236 | 34 RF流: 一个阶段只能有一个侧重点, 要么VO2max, 要么LT, 要么endurance,
着重一个,其他的无所谓。 我上个plan, 在训练VO2max阶段的时候, longrun
都跑的非常慢非常累。。
runner必须吃carb, 就算在减肥。 可以减少总热量, 但是carb还是要吃。。
.
5K
were
regular |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 35 Usually they when they talk about aerobic capacity, they mean vo2max, which
is the maximum amount of oxygen you can consume, and mainly improved in
vo2max interval sessions.
On the other hand, base/aerobic training does improve cardiovascular fitness
,
aka aerobic ability, which means the muscle can use oxygen and remove waste
more efficiently, by increasing the density of capillaries (small blood
vessels), mitochondria, and oxidative enzyme, etc. I think base training
does make you faster aerob... 阅读全帖 |
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t********e 发帖数: 32 | 36 chip time 3:02:44,garmin split:
Type Distance Time Total Time Pace Avg HR Max HR Notes
Interval 1 Mi 7:59.44 7:59.44 8:00
Interval 1 Mi 6:21.78 14:21.22 6:22
Interval 1 Mi 6:41.23 21:02.45 6:42
Interval 1 Mi 6:33.62 27:36.07 6:34
Interval 1 Mi 6:35.96 34:12.03 6:36
Interval 1 Mi 6:37.62 40:49.65 6:38
Interval... 阅读全帖 |
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c*******r 发帖数: 13580 | 37 VO2max is a biological indicator and it's universal, it's VDOT that takes
into consideration of the ability to utilize VO2max. Lance's marathon
performance was actually pretty good after some proper training.
Cycling and running are somewhat similar in terms of general fitness. But
they could be very different in terms of muscle usage. Cycling uses more
inner quads and running uses more outer quads. But I think the more
important difference is that cycling has much lower impact. You also work in... 阅读全帖 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 38 什么是MAF?
MAF是max aerobic function,具体可以看这里:
http://www.markallenonline.com/maoArticles.aspx?AID=2
http://www.philmaffetone.com/maftest.cfm
怎样确定MAF HR?
如果你maxHR跟统计公式比较吻合,可以用180-age,否则可以用80%maxHR或74%
HRReserve。
例如我maxHR=180, MAF HR=150 (80%maxHR or 74%HRReserve)
MAF-15=135(72.5%maxHR or 64%HRReserve),大概是easy pace的心率。
我是怎样做MAF test的?
找一个不是特别累,天气也不错的日子,去跑道上测,需要带HR monitor。
warmup 1-2 miles
interval 1: 6 laps (2400m) at MAF HR-15
rest 90 seconds
interval 2: 6 laps (2400m) at MAF HR
cooldown
每个interval尽... 阅读全帖 |
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b***i 发帖数: 10018 | 39 因为AM是linear periodization,越接近peak速度越快。
有其他的plan是先做vo2max的,也有些plan是一直都做vo2max的。 |
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R*****s 发帖数: 41236 | 40 连续40分钟不是练VO2max, 是练lactate threshold, 又叫tempo run..
VO2max是 6x800 这种, AM 上心跳也只有93-95% HRmax.. |
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a***n 发帖数: 428 | 41 牛啊!
请教一下,VO2max是不是必须经由严格的训练才有可能提高,如果只是一般健身性质的
easy run,效果如何呢?另外,普通人群的VO2max在一般程度的训练,也就是健身后,
提高的幅度大概有多少?谢谢了!
(
be
peak
,
of |
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a***n 发帖数: 428 | 42 嗯,还很悲催的意识到自己一直以来就是在瞎跑,根本还未入门。
村上春树45岁还能每天跑6迈,每周跑6天……
另,看到关于跑步和心肺的那个帖子,有位大牛关于VO2max的论述,令我很敬畏,
VO2max是攸关生死啊,是不是不seriously training,就不会提高呢,顶多能使之随年
龄下降慢些呢? |
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o*******r 发帖数: 4921 | 43 这么少啊。这个跑法原来村上也是个酱油党啊。
嗯,还很悲催的意识到自己一直以来就是在瞎跑,根本还未入门。
村上春树45岁还能每天跑6迈,每周跑6天……
另,看到关于跑步和心肺的那个帖子,有位大牛关于VO2max的论述,令我很敬畏,
VO2max是攸关生死啊,是不是不seriously training,就不会提高呢,顶多能使之随年
龄下降慢些呢? |
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x******9 发帖数: 1866 | 44 高尔夫运动员不太清楚,有人作过研究100/200 elite不比高尔夫强。还有意思是是说
在elite 400米水平45秒这个样子,VO2max不起啥决定作用,速度是关键。当然如果一
个人玩儿了命了只能跑一分多钟的话,VO2max应该作用大些。 |
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j***y 发帖数: 5098 | 45 ☆─────────────────────────────────────☆
ironman2015 (1/2 ironman) 于 (Mon Sep 26 20:02:56 2011, 美东) 提到:
如果用5:43的pace跑
☆─────────────────────────────────────☆
LT100 (Kilian's quest) 于 (Mon Sep 26 20:09:23 2011, 美东) 提到:
If it's done at 5K race pace, then you can rest for as long as 5 minutes.
You know the difference between a distance runner's 400m rep workout and a
sprinter's 400m workout? The distance runner rests for 1 min or less whereas
the sprinter rests for 10-15 min in between set... 阅读全帖 |
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R*****s 发帖数: 41236 | 46 嗯,他这个说的是Interval提高aerobic capacity(Vo2max), 跟有氧(燃脂)
能力感觉还是不太一样,Vo2max训练在马拉松训练里面其实并不是太重要... |
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u******a 发帖数: 7843 | 47 据我所知1迈的速度主要看VO2max, 更长一点才看LT...不过如果VO2max牛逼, LT又高,
那就是大牛了... |
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o***n 发帖数: 416 | 48 这个很厉害,能从145减到118。不过男的到118的确没啥油水可减了。
我问体重的原因是猜测pace提高的另一个可能性是体重下降。按照Vo2max的定义,每减
10%的体重,Vo2max就提高10%。如果体重处于平台,那MAF的训练效果就直接显示出来
了。
希望CIM跑完后有机会大家一起跑跑,交流交流。 |
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w**********g 发帖数: 2077 | 49 AM里面有这5k95%的数据。5k配逨的间歇主练VO2Max,中文叫最大摄氧量,其实主练有
氧极限能力,Aerobic Capacity。
所谓练无氧只是附带目的,也是一种习惯叫法。
要练更快的就不一样了。我们大多数人还到不了那个训练水平。
概念上最方便就是忽略无氧,只用有氧,LT.VO2Max来指导训练 |
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x******g 发帖数: 2165 | 50 上周末跑完long run,脚踝的疼有点加重。昨天的easy run 就没跑,换成cross
training。
今天早上也一直拿不定主意,要不要跑tempo。 不过开始跑以后,感觉不错,就坚持跑
下来了。
本来是11miles with 7miles@半马速度。最后多跑了一迈,一共跑了8迈@ 7:20 pace,
最后心跳push到了90% MHR。 跑完感觉挺不错,比long run 轻松。不过悲惨的是,洗
完澡穿衣服的时候才发现,脚底起了一个大水泡,里面都出血了。现在走路都疼,看来
需要休息两天了。请问有经验的同学,有什么办法能好的快点吗?还是不管它,让它自
己好?
还有一个问题就是,剩下几周的AM55计划里基本没有tempo run,都是VO2max。因为自
己跑过几次5k race, 是不是可以不跑VO2max, 把它们都改成tempo run? |
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